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  #1  
Old 06-25-2008, 07:00 AM
jerx jerx is offline
 
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Default Learn to program - where to start?

I like to learn how to program. A few years ago I started to use ikonboard, phpbb and then vbulletin. I have modified their look to my needs and also added some hacks. That is why I have basic knowledge of html, css and even a little bit of php.

But since my frustration gets bigger and bigger, because I always have to look and wait for scripts or hacks, which do what I want but in the end do not suit my needs, I like to learn from scratch. My goal is to add hacks to vbulletin and open source scripts, so that they do exactly what I want. At the end of that long journey I might want to completely switch over to my own scripts, at least stop using open source scripts since their development pace is too slow and they do not suit my needs very well.

I read that learning php as the first language is not recommended. Perl has been suggested, but I do not like to begin with perl, since I don' t see any use for that language. Therefore I was thinking of beginning with Ruby (on rails). It seems to be a good language for newbies like me. The only problem I see is that unlike Perl Ruby might not be similar structured as php, so that it takes much more time until I have reached my goal.

However I am thinking of getting to know Ruby first. I was looking at these books:
Beginning Ruby: From Novice to Professional (Beginning from Novice to Professional) - Peter Cooper
The Ruby Programming Language - David Flanagan
The Ruby Way, Second Edition: Solutions and Techniques in Ruby Programming (2nd Edition) - Hal Fulton

Afterwards I would tackle php:
PHP 6 and MySQL 5 for Dynamic Web Sites: Visual QuickPro Guide - Larry Ullman
PHP and MySQL Web Development (3rd Edition) (Developer's Library) - Luke Welling

Do you recommend buying a book for mastering html and css, too? I have seen that vbulletin add-ons use xml files. Do you also need in-depth knowledge of xml?

Although I think that learning all that stuff is necessary, I fear to stumble along that long ride. It might be too much input and too time consuming. Do you have recommendations how to stay focused and reach my goal? I think it might help to read the beginners guide to Ruby only and then concentrate on php.

I have read that some acquired the fundamentals and then jumped right in trying to code what they really needed. Some also recommended looking at other coders' code. vb.org seems to suggest online tutorials. The sticky in this forum points to such a site. There you can learn php, too. Unfortunately there is noghting about Ruby.

I think there is no golden way. Everyone is different and some methods might work for one but not for the other. Nonetheless there are some trails which are not recommended at all and others which need to be taken by everyone. As an experienced coder you might have come across things which you now classify as useless whereas you thought it was the only way to go at that time.

If you do not have any recommendations for me, I like to know how you started learning php or programming. If there are any other books I should consider reading, please post them.

Looking forward to your replies. Thank you for your time!
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  #2  
Old 06-25-2008, 07:07 AM
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Dismounted Dismounted is offline
 
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Learning PHP will be easy if you have any sort of background in C/C++, even if you don't have any previous coding experience, learning PHP is fairly easy.

My suggestion is to buy a good book - as it will guide you a lot.
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Old 06-25-2008, 08:22 AM
Marco van Herwaarden Marco van Herwaarden is offline
 
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Start with a language that you will actually use on a regular basis. Learning from books can only teach you 10%, the rest you learn by using it a lot and reading other scripts in the same language. I would just start with PHP if i where you.
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Old 06-25-2008, 07:40 PM
MoT3rror MoT3rror is offline
 
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Just to answer your question about XML, I found XML very similar to HTML making it very simple to learn for me. If you know HTML, it should take you a couple of days to learn XML.
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Old 06-25-2008, 11:18 PM
jerx jerx is offline
 
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Thanks for your replies!

I decided to start with php directly, although I have no c/c++ or better said programming experience in general. I have already bought the php book by Larry Ullman. So far it looks very promising. In addidtion to that I will read the tutorials at w3schools.com to improve my xhtml skills. Afterwards I will read on xml.

I am curious how long it takes until I can add my own add-ons to vbulletin. I hope that Marco is wrong and books teach you more than 10%, otherwise I fear it takes too long and I might even give up.
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