Where vB is going wrong

[Mark.B]

This post saddens me, but I've been tempted to post it for a long time. Now the time has come.

I love vB as a product, and there's no problem at the official support forum (vb.com) but over here things have gotten silly.

First of all, let me say I fully understand that people provide support of their own free will. It's not a slur on anyone like that, it's more a general observation.

Several years ago when I first came here there were plenty of people willing to assist and help people who may lack expertise. Such help was offered gladly and politely.

Lately though, things have changed for the worst. For example, look in the 'hack requests' forums and see the HUGE number of totally ignored requests, or ones responded to with a curt 'use the search button'.

Then go into some of the hack threads. You are lucky to get any response at all these days, and when you do, it's often 'read the thread' or 'read the rules' or 'learn to code before you ask'.

It is extremely unfriendly and off putting, and I have to say that other forum software now has much better hack support for the less experienced user.

Obviously this isn't universal but it's a growing trend. If this isn't to become an elitist community for experienced coders only, then people need to start being a bit more understanding of the fact that not everyone is an experienced php coder and not everyone has managed to read every single rule/sticky/announcement on here before posting.

In short, there's no need for people to be rude or 'off' with people for simply asking questions.

[firstrebel]

I support Mark.B's comments with one exception. It has long been the unwritten rule with forums that if you wanted to find out something you did a search first as your question may have been already covered.

The trend now seems to be not to bother to read the thread but ask the question. This then increases the size of the thread and makes reading through it for info more difficult, as some threads here are over 20 pages.

Bob

/me click not-install

to me, the level of support comes with the level of ability for members to be independant and able to do things by themselves... i've seen a lot of these requests lately, made by the same guys, that are not able to do a simple search... we have to do the search for them and show them how to...

it's easier for them to complain that they have no answer for their somewhat strange requests sometimes too... when you require to rebuild half of vbulletin for your own needs and think you will have someone that will gladely do this for free in the minute, you are wrong... and we have seen that in the last days...

if you think that other softwares have better support for their hacks, remember something here: vb.org is not managed by vb.com, and is completely unsupported by the company... this is the opposite of all the other communities you know...

anyway, this is another complaint thread that will turn into a flaming ground soon... see ya!

[Paul M]

I know what thread triggered this, and tbh, it's only the fact I don't have that particular hack installed that stopped me commenting when I read it - "Read the rules" was not a very helpful reply to a question.

[Reeve of shinra]

Not that I agree or disagree, but its not exactly easy to find stuff around here now a days. Hopefully that will change when the "hack database" comes out.

[vBintense]

I have to concur with the original thread. I have a few hacks I wanted to release but I am still a bit put off over the war about paid mods or not.

Three years ago this community was a community, if someone asked a redundant question it was either nicely pointed to the right thread (with a link) or help was given.

There is no reason for anyone to think they are so much better that they can have an animosity to another member who may be new and lost, perhaps what he is looking for has came up in search with 3000 results, so he sifts thru not understanding what is what.

As for those who think the new members need to learn to use the search option better or to become as expert as them over night, if it upsets you so badly why not just ignore the thread and not cause more aggravation in an already tense community.

Posts that flame or back handed comments are rapid here as of late, not like it was 3 years ago. People just seem to trash this community and not even think to just keep their mouse to another thread link.

Then you get the coders who still really care about the community and the original reason it was made (to share and to help) who work hard to try to help others, they support their hacks, and even try to bring out new. And from the already cut throat mentality to the newer people, they now come back and fester the threads with information of new hacks with turmoil.

Now while there are many good staff here who do very good job, or try to bring the threads back into the right track, they can not do it alone. It is up to the community to actually re-learn the caring and the reason why .org is even here. If this does not happen it will just spiral more.

[Mark.B]

Originally Posted by nexialys

[high]* nexialys click not-install
[/high]

to me, the level of support comes with the level of ability for members to be independant and able to do things by themselves... i've seen a lot of these requests lately, made by the same guys, that are not able to do a simple search... we have to do the search for them and show them how to...

it's easier for them to complain that they have no answer for their somewhat strange requests sometimes too... when you require to rebuild half of vbulletin for your own needs and think you will have someone that will gladely do this for free in the minute, you are wrong... and we have seen that in the last days...

if you think that other softwares have better support for their hacks, remember something here: vb.org is not managed by vb.com, and is completely unsupported by the company... this is the opposite of all the other communities you know...

anyway, this is another complaint thread that will turn into a flaming ground soon... see ya!

That's certainly valid, and there's no harm in checking that people have tried searching first, but it's the WAY it's said, too often there's a sort of arrogance and superiority that comes over and that never used to be there.

I don't want to start flame wars, I am trying to be constructive. I don't dislike this site at all, it's still great, but it seems to be heading in a way that isn't pleasant, and that's the users rather than the moderators or admins.

Originally Posted by Paul M

I know what thread triggered this, and tbh, it's only the fact I don't have that particular hack installed that stopped me commenting when I read it - "Read the rules" was not a very helpful reply to a question.

Yes, you're right in that that is what finally triggered me to post this, but it's something that's been on my mind for a while. It has not happened to me so much because I rarely post for help, but I have seen it done so many times to others and I think 'that is not fair'.

I would like to say though that Paul M is a shining example of how it SHOULD be done, his hack support is incredible...efficient, polite and to the point. I have a couple of Paul's hacks installed.....way to go!

[Marco van Herwaarden]

Originally Posted by Mark.B

I am trying to be constructive.

Originally Posted by Mark.B

Anyone who likes it should be tied down and have pins inserted into their feet.

(From: https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthrea...493#post851493)

But i do agree to some point. And this already starts by 10 people 'advicing' someone that he should not have posted in a hack forum, instead of just silently reporting the post and let a moderator have a chance of moving it to the correct forum without setting a negative tone.

[Mark.B]

Originally Posted by MarcoH64

(From: https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthrea...493#post851493)

But i do agree to some point. And this already starts by 10 people 'advicing' someone that he should not have posted in a hack forum, instead of just silently reporting the post and let a moderator have a chance of moving it to the correct forum without setting a negative tone.

Well obviously in the post you refer to I was being humourous rather than constructive.

I *still* hate auto-merging...it has happened to me in this thread too. But that's for another topic....

[KTBleeding]

Something that has always bugged me is that in the event where someone releases a hack that has already been released.

Someone will always have to jump in and say, "Already released.... :link to thread:"

Maybe I'm just reading/taking that in the wrong way.. but I find that rude. Chances are that the person already knows about the other hack but didn't find what they wanted out of it so they made their own and decided to share it here.

Aside from that, I think it's obvious that as the years go on.. more and more children get vBulletin licenses. That's why you can say things like, "Three years ago this.. and four years ago that.." I just see a lot of immaturity here anymore.. Sometimes I'll open my mouth, but most of the time I just ignore it and move on.