Regarding IPB's smilies copyright

[MRGTB]

Maybe the defaults one were, I would'nt know. But a few years ago I was browsing an IPB site, and the owner was asking members to upload there very own IPB smilies that they had created themselves for use with IPB boards. Don't ask me now what the site was, I just don't know. Too long ago.

But at the time, some of the smilies created by the members were just like the default IPB smilies, animated one's and all that which are quite common today and used on many IPB boards.

In fact, I'm not even sure if it was a thread created on the offical IPB board itself at the time. But there were pages after pages of the IPB custom smilies that members created. Not IPB themselves, or another artist working for them.

[Quillz]

Originally Posted by MRGTB

Maybe the defaults one were, I would'nt know. But a few years ago I was browsing an IPB site, and the owner was asking members to upload there very own IPB smilies that they had created themselves for use with IPB boards. Don't ask me now what they site was, I just don't know.

But at the time, some of the smilies created by the members were just like the default IPB smilies, animated one's and all that which are quite common today and used on many IPB boards.

In fact, I'm not even sure if it was a thread created on the offical IPB board itself at the time. But there were pages after pages of the IPB custom smilies that members created. Not IPB

I think the "core" emoticons (the standard happy, sad, etc.) were created by James Mathias, whereas many of the other ones (ones that wave signs, etc.) were fan-made.

[mtha]

Originally Posted by MRGTB

Well I'll just drop my wallet on the drive after near the main road with ?100 quid hanging out of it, my guess is everybody will respect it's on my property and not take it. Yeah right!

I'll also leave my car door wide open with the keys in the ignition running, people will respect me and not take the car. Yeah right!

Thats what you should have said.

If you class taking some smilies as theft in your eyes, well what can I say. Except were all criminals then and we should be locked up and the key thrown away! LOL

that's right. even if you drop your wallet with ?100000 in it, anyone found it "should" return it to you, or bring it to a police station, to return it to you.
Anyone attempts to take it, is doing illegal thing.

if the owner claim their right, and if it's their work/product, it's their. You dont expect to see someone taking your car, driving in front of you, and you dont have any legal right to take it back, do you?

re. the smilies, if they dont want you to use it, just use vB smilies, or if you like IPB smilies that much, make a deal with them, or create ones that look similar, with your own differences.

[MRGTB]

If only your view of things was shared by everybody else in the world. Sadly that's just not the case.

Your speaking for yourself and your own point of view, which means nothing to me really, while many others would pick up the wallet up and steal the car without thinking twice. As well as the smilies.

[unenergizer]

Originally Posted by MRGTB

If only your view of things was shared by everybody else in the world. Sadly that's just not the case.

Your speaking for yourself and your own point of view, which means nothing to me really, while many others would pick up the wallet up and steal the car without thinking twice. As well as the smilies.

I dont think you quite get the point mtha was making. Would you be mad if I copied your site design, and all your content and stole your forum members? You put work into your site and you dont want people taking away the value of your site by using your hard work. Your right they may be smilies, but someone spent time editing each and every smilie. They put work into that. If they want to keep them for personal use on there site only, then let it be. Do not steal there hard work. Go make your own. These are ethics. If you were an experienced designer or programmer, you would understand this better. This is the best I can explain this, if you still dont understand then there is no hope.

[MRGTB]

I do get the point, I just think it's a bit over the top really. If a persons custom skin he'd paid good money for had been ripped off. I could relate to that.

But were talking about smilies, forums all over the net just download and use smilies for there boards regardless of who created them. I just don't think it's a big deal thats all.

[Snake]

Well, I have contacted IPS regarding this and here's a little respond from them...

The emoticons used in IPB are available to the public domain, since their creator released them as such. Whether you are entitled to use derivative works that someone else has made, though, is something you'll have to figure out with them - it isn't really anything to do with IPS.

My personal opinion though, is that its bit of a cheek for them to make minor edits to something available completely free, then not offer the same availablity to others.

(Note: other IPB graphics, such as buttons, aren't in the public domain, and therefore the IPB license applies - just in case there's any confusion)

Um, you aren't plagiarizing. Plagiarism is taking someone else's ideas or language (written or verbal) without permission and representing it as your own original work. Their claim should have been copyright infringement.

I don't know how it works in other countries. In the US although not tested at our Supreme Court level yet, lower courts here have ruled derivative works of public domain images cannot be protected by copyright unless they show sufficient originality. IMO colorization and background transparency won't cut it. Laws in your or their country may be different.

(Please don't take what I say as legal advice, this is my own so called "informed guessing" - do wait for confirmation)

The smilies, I believe, are under the same license as IP.Board, meaning that to use them or their derivitive works would require a license from IPS, Inc. That said, using them on vBulletin would most certainly NOT be in the spirit of that license unless you also had an IP.Board license (yes, even if slightly modified - the law of derivitive works applies). You say that there's no need for permission because IPS made the smilies. That's exactly why you must get permission, they're a component of IP.Board - a commercial product.

Now to see whether IPS intends to just "let it fly" so to speak. They may, or may not, allow you to use them. I wouldn't hold out too many hopes though, they've already viciously attacked someone using the buttons without permission (or credit)

I think you guys still don't get it. It's not like THEY were the ones who ORIGINALLY made the smilies. They were from IPB so the only thing they had to do was change its color and background transparency. Nothing more.