Suggestions: How to bring vBulletin.org back to what it was before...

[Revan]

I can't say much about the "glory days" as the only memory of vBulletin I had before joining here was when I installed a pirated vB2 on my site and was in awe at how much better it was than wBB, but I took it down because I was too scared of getting legal letters...


About the graphics sections, my opinion is divided.
For one I completely understand how it takes the focus away from the coding, which is what the core of this site was. But on the other hand, it's sort of frustrating for users (ie non-hackers/designers) to have to register on three sites in order to get everything official vBulletin has to offer. vBcom, vBorg and vBTemp.
I suppose this could be remedied by allowing the graphics sections to be completely hidden, similar to the 3.0 and 2.0 forums can (or should) be.

Your post elaborates on something I said in one of the drama threads, something like "What makes a newbie into a hacker? Willpower and motivation. The newbie is responsible for the willpower, vBorg is responsible for the motivation."
I use the term newbie meaning someone new to this site.

What do you propose we do about whiners? I mean people like in the "for those who have left" thread who can do nothing but put down every single attempt the staff does at accomodating the hackers' wishes.

What do you propose we do about offering motivation? Not everybody releases their work because they use it on the site. To use myself as an example, I used to work on the RPG because I used it on my forum, but now I dont have one and therefore that motivation is lost. I only not quit working on the hack because Id feel bad about saying "well sod this, Im out.", so do you have any solution as to providing motivation to keep coming back to code?

Hope to hear more on this, and pray this thread be free of lamers.

[MJM]

Well ... firstly I want to say that I don't think the essence or spirit of this community is lost. It is (mostly) preserved in all the contributions that have been made to this site.
Most vB users, (including me) don't regularly come here to gain insight through these discussions or ponder inhouse debate, but to utilize the mods that others have generously provided.
It is only a relatively small number who are part of daily going-ons, or return from the past and may perceive mole hills as mountains, so to speak.

I am writing for several reasons ...
This software, combined with a photo gallery application means very very much too me. It has enabled me on a small income to put my life's work on the net in an interactive community environment. My wishes were simply to share info, ideas and experiences regarding my profession - as a mostly recreational artist in a specialized medium - in a non-commercial environment.
It has evolved, from a site comprised of mostly newbies wanting to learn, to increasing numbers of up-and-coming professionals who need to find ways to make a living from their acquired talents.
(even though a large number of members use their talents primarily as a recreational hobby)

Now I am faced with the challenge of deciding what level or direction of commercialization to take the site, without losing the integrity of a site that was based on sharing without expectation of monetary gains.

This is where I see similarities.
vB.org has provided this community for learning and sharing.
Now many have become or are becoming professionals and need to make something from it to justify the effort spent.
(even though a large number share their talents and consider it a recreational hobby)

There is another similarity
In proportion to my membership base, and to vB's membership base, it is only a small percentage of members who have made most of the contributions of content, or code to the community.

This clearly demonstrates that it is not necessary to provide a commercial platform for the whole world to engage in, but rather, one could bring together a smaller team of professionals to develop content/code, and thereby retain the integrity of the community as one of members helping members.
This still leaves open the possibility of having a separate paid resource directory.

Well, as a non-coder I'm not qualified to give any opinions on the direction of vB.org but to wish you the best.
Thanks for giving me the opportunity to share these thoughts.

Goodnight ... er good morning
Mark

[Lottis]

Wow, i dident even know that it worked out this way once.
I purshased a lisens fore three years ago, perhaps four. Stopped counting.
But i dident dare to try out any hacks. Silly me, but i was a complete newbee and rather paid other to do it.
So i missed the "glory" days.

I pretty mutch agree to all your points, TECK. But i fell there is plenty of room fore both designers and coders/hackers.
The skills of some of the grafic and designs are fore me, absolut fabiolus.
The same goes to the hackers/coders.

Not everyone have been sitting infront of there computers since they turned 13- 14 years old. Most of this is a new world to me.

I think there have been to mutch demanding. When someone demands other peopel to do something, they simply wont do it.

I think one of the most importent thing here is, witch role should admin/moderator have in this place.
Cant they also bee members to? Like Boofo, hes always happy and always try to see the things positiv. But instead, hes getting crap fore not beeing to seriuos.

The worst thing i can read here, is a smartass, that thinks everyone is in a high skills level with codes Yes, we can get better using the sears button. But it isent always we get a good answer just by searshing.

Isent vBorg a playground actually, shouldent it be fun to be here?
Some peopel, do this fore a living. So i understand that they have to get paid some how.

*sorry fore my bad english*

[tehste]

I don't like your first point and the other points... Well they are no fun!

[Boofo]

Originally Posted by tehste

I don't like your first point and the other points... Well they are no fun!

Which post are you referring to? You totally lost me there. :cross-eyed:

[TECK]

Originally Posted by tehste

I don't like your first point and the other points... Well they are no fun!

Hi tehste,

Please post what you think it should be organized the vB.org community.
Avoid the stereotype that people adopted on this site. Tell us why you don't like the points, develop, discuss, interact with people.

[tehste]

Ok the people running this site have made some mistakes. The biggest problem is between peaks of activity they all dissapear. There are too many personal battles going on which takes its toll. Also I think because Jelsoft are so -involved- they should either appoint the staff or remove their involvement.

The second reason is the attitude of the users. Just because someone has a vbulletin license does not give them the right to free support on community addons. If the features you want aren't there why not add them yourself. Or atleast try! Ok so your not willing to spend some time learning or as it is said: "I can't code because I don't have the time LOL". Ironically I can't be bothered finishing this point.

Thirdly the staff restructure is lame and will only make things messier.

[michaelbenson]

I don't see how retaining a ban on the promotion and discussion of commerical modifications will help to build a cohesive environment? Rather than completely ignore and disregard the existence of these modifications why not generate a self moderated database or directory of these modifications which are after all helping to contribute towards the vBulletin "experience". Rather than being an "Ultimate vBulletin Resource (minus all commercial entities)", why not actually live upto your slogan?

[Tralala]

Originally Posted by tehste

Ok the people running this site have made some mistakes. The biggest problem is between peaks of activity they all dissapear. There are too many personal battles going on which takes its toll. Also I think because Jelsoft are so -involved- they should either appoint the staff or remove their involvement.

Agreed, wholeheartedly. I'm relatively new here, but the personal conflicts, vendettas and agendas seem clear.

Originally Posted by tehste

The second reason is the attitude of the users. Just because someone has a vbulletin license does not give them the god given right to free support on community addons. If the features you want aren't there why not add them yourself. Or atleast try! Ok so your not willing to spend some time learning or as it is said: "I can't code because I don't have the time LOL". Ironically I can't be bothered finishing this point.

I'll agree with this too, but I've seen some attitude from coders too. If you make suggestions or ask questions about how to modify something in their code to better suit your needs, they get surly. It can be tough for a beginner, trying to learn, in an environment like that.

Originally Posted by tehste

Thirdly the staff restructure is lame and will only make things messier.

I'm inclined to agree on this too, but am willing to wait and see.

At the very least I'd like to know why an innocuous post I'd made here was deleted within 5 minutes of me making it, with no explanation whatsoever to me. I PM'ed a bunch of staff members, and got no answer.

This place sure feels weird at times... like children are running the show. Considering it's a forum of forum administrators, one would think those in positions of authority would have a very strong handle on these matters.

[Revan]

Ok its 00:30 so Im gonna be brief.

Originally Posted by tehste

Ok the people running this site have made some mistakes. The biggest problem is between peaks of activity they all dissapear. There are too many personal battles going on which takes its toll. Also I think because Jelsoft are so -involved- they should either appoint the staff or remove their involvement.

Agreed.

Originally Posted by tehste

The second reason is the attitude of the users. Just because someone has a vbulletin license does not give them the god given right to free support on community addons. If the features you want aren't there why not add them yourself. Or atleast try! Ok so your not willing to spend some time learning or as it is said: "I can't code because I don't have the time LOL". Ironically I can't be bothered finishing this point.

Agreed + laffin not-quite-out loud.

Originally Posted by tehste

Thirdly the staff restructure is lame and will only make things messier.

Disagreed.
I think the staff restructure can not only lead to good things (more features(coding)/better design(design)/better customer support(customer)) but its a way of rewarding deserving contributors to the site (with one exception for unknown reasons... (please dont take this personally christianb, I don't know you and Im sure your a great guy and a good coder, I just have never heard about you before you showed up on the staff page ))

Ok that was too many parenthesisesees, Im off for sleep.
And yes Im fully aware I will feel dumb for writing this dribble in the morning.