Not as many hackers?

[LanciaStratos]

Is it just me, or does there seem to be less and less people responding to requests? :confused: I've seen quite a few great ideas without any responses. :(

[Aman]

It's nice to make a fancy looking new site but I don't understand why the hacks section goes to vbulletin.org and was not left on vbulletin.com. I would think this move would only work to dissuade hackers and users from actually participating in the hacks forums - unfortunate! I would have rather seen vbulletin.org become a prototype board where people could just test out new hacks and beta features by actually seeing and using them. It is not too late, why not return the hacks forum to vbulletin.com and just add most all the hacks to the prototype board for people to actually experience them so they may decide how they think vbulletin should further develop?

[Crinos]

I think one of the reasons it was moved here is so that the vbulletin.com support staff would not be obligated to answer hacking questions :) Since hacking is a support nightmare because of all the tinkering involved, they just wanted to give notice that, although they endorse vb.org, they don't actually include it in their support responsibilities ;)

[Aman]

Why not write as a little disclaimer on the hacker's forum that support will not be provided for that forum?

[Reeve of shinra]

That notice is there, which goes to show how well its noticed and taken into consideration.

Most of however know that hacks arent officially supported by VBulletin. Most us are used to dealing with programs and computers - so when something goes wrong, we know that if we undo it 99% of the time our forums will still work while we ask the hacker for help.

Newbies don't. I can easilly see them asking for help and a VBulletin tech going through the motions of tracking down the problem. Thats time and resources that could be spent keeping prices down and improving the next release.

As a consumer, if it helps keep prices down and improves support and contuined development - then by all means - to a new url I shall go =)

[FWC]

Originally posted by Reeve of shinra
That notice is there, which goes to show how well its noticed and taken into consideration.

As a consumer, if it helps keep prices down and improves support and contuined development - then by all means - to a new url I shall go =) I couldn't agree more.

[LanciaStratos]

As a consumer, if it helps keep prices down and improves support and contuined development - then by all means - to a new url I shall go =) Even if it hinders the development of new modifications? :(

[FWC]

Originally posted by LanciaStratos
Even if it hinders the development of new modifications? :( I don't think it is.

[Aman]

We will see! However, I think more traffic to the hackers forums will equate into more innovation and more innovation will equate in greater revenues due to a consistantly better vbulletin. For the people that bother support staff in the hackers forum a generic form post will do: Sorry, the hack forum is not supported. Please contact the authors of the hacks for any assistance.

[Bender]

this has been discussed in deep detail on vbulletin.com (vb2.2 release-discus), and, quite frankly, I think it's a little insulting to sinecure and firefly to bring up the issue of usefulness of vbulletin.org.
I think there may be less 'hack-interested' users here than on old hackforums on vbulletin.com, but this will change - some users were lost, but new ones will appear ;)

[Aman]

I disagree on both points. I believe my comments are far from insulting to firefly and sincere in my saying that this separate hackers site will draw less hackers and therefore harm the growth of the hacker’s community. It has nothing to do with how nice the board is (the new board is absolutely beautiful!) but only the fact that it is not part of vbulletin.com’s board. In fact I think vbulletin.org would be a fantastic prototype board where hackers could see examples of how far one could take vbulletin if they were to take the time to modify it will all the great hacks and template mods people have painstakingly made. I also have an idea to have the best of both worlds, why not make a hack so vbulletin.org is integrated with vbulletin.com. In other words, so that this board becomes a customized sub forum within the other board but once the forum heading is clicked all the nice features and great design is available but still functions as part of the main community board as vbulletin.com? This could be called the boards within boards hack.

Anyway, I also disagree with the belief that some people will not use the board but others will come to make up the difference. I think the reasonable assumption is that because of the extra steps (work) involved in using two boards with separate urls and registrations a ratio of far more users will be lost then gained. I also don't see the logic in the argument that having the hacker's forum on vbulletin.com will necessarily mean more support issues because the hacker folks generate much of the free support by the community. Now they will be on this site and not as much on the other to offer their free advice leaving more of the burden on actual staff. Moreover, just because this has been discussed before doesn't mean it shouldn't be again after the results become apparent. After all, being something new, isn't this an experiment and so requiring actual feedback as we go?

As I mentioned, we will see! I could obviously be wrong. But aren’t we already witnessing a trend here!

[FWC]

Originally posted by Aman
But aren?t we already witnessing a trend here! What trend? I just logged on and there are 80 new posts since I was here late last night. The Hacks forum at vbulletin.com was not more active than that.

[Admin]

FWIW, here are some stats I just gathered.
I will let you decide.

[FWC]

Originally posted by FireFly
FWIW, here are some stats I just gathered.
I will let you decide. I'm glad to see the facts back up my observations. :)

[Aman]

As the board is new and all the writers of hacks have to move their postings over to the new board and a new version of vbulletin was just released that requires many hacks to be changed, as well as the novelty factor, I would expect a short surge in threads and posts. However, I would be more interested in seeing a longer-term measure of statistics and the comparison of the old hack forum statistics. Keep in mind also that there is a new lounge and general discussion area that would borrow interest from the chitchat forum on vbulletin as some of the biggest posters are interested more in hack development. Moreover, I believe stats on "views" is also very important because many new users of vbulletin may feel they are just learning and so don't have much to say on posts while being very interested in actually reading them.

My argument is that the split in boards may also cause a split in the vbulletin community where basic license holders and advanced hackers are more segregated and so don't benefit as fully as they could from each other (hackers getting less feedback and interest in their code and newbies getting less senior advice on setting up their boards to their full potential).

As I mentioned, I could easily be wrong. However, the logic that the more work and more time required to toggle between two different boards will dissuade people from sharing information and interest between the users of both boards to the level they would if both communities were integrated (with fewer clicks, one registration, and added simplicity), has not yet been shown to be incorrect. I am just saying that the experiment to separate the boards should be monitored closely as the hacks forum is critical to vbulletin innovation and I would hate to loose any percentage of the human resources available to strengthen it. The metaphor I would use is it is as if amazon.com changed their one click shopping to 14 click shopping with really cool features and beautifully designed pages and expected the move to generate more sales. I believe adding more complication, clicks, and work is a recipe for less overall users. But then, and I sincerely mean this, you are all smart folks so I will respect your choice as I am sure it was made analytically and pragmatically. I know that in the end we all just want the best for our favorite board vbulletin and it was in that spirit that I shared my views. Cheers - I do love the new look and feel of the board!

[SWFans.net]

I support the move to vbulletin.org and appreciate all the new features available to us that could only be possible here. The ability to track installed hacks is absolutely marvelous as is the ability to get a general idea how many people have installed a hack you may have released. The atmosphere created by the contributors to this forum is friendly and helpful. It has a team-like feel to it, which IMO, will only make for better, more complete, and more functional hacks.

Thank yous go out to the creators and maintainers of this site for what they have provided those of us who enjoy learning more about the software we own and making the software we own work for us in the ways that we want to. :)