I think I've had enough

[Scott MacVicar]

I have a pretty nice vBulletin polo shorts lying about, starting to get a bit worn but I'm sure I could get an extra dozen when I get my new ones.

We'd need to have two seperate groups meet with everyone, I think getting everyone together could intimidate people when it comes to speaking their mind. When I said top coders i just meant those who are active and have released a fair number of hacks and would be willing to at least have a discussion.

[Logikos]

Originally Posted by Brad

What we have to do is move passed all this negative thinking, so lets try to steer this thread in a direction that will benefit this site and it's users instead of causing more drama. So if you have a suggestion let me hear it by posting here, or in the site feedback forum, or send me a private message if you'd rather not post it in public. I will listen, I will respond, and I will do everything in my power to make the changes the membership requires.

I'd like to start with my post here & Revans here.

You will have to filter through alot of our text to see the suggested features.

[hambil]

I second LiveWire and Raven's suggestions, and I've also made a few suggestions in the past I think are worth repeating: here and here.

[Bubble #5]

Originally Posted by LiveWire

If it wasn't for the coders, I would not know what I know now.

Exactly. Which is why the following statemnet is so out of touch and detrimental toward vB:

Originally Posted by Zachery

They are not, they are just part of the community, the other 99.99% of the users on this site are its lifeblood. Not a few users who do happen to code hacks.

Apparently there are some at vB who seem to think that good coders are in a never-ending vast infinite supply. Their mindset seems to suggest that there is some invisible vast mountain of good coders just chomping at the bit to be here - there isn't. Good coders, and I mean the truly good coders, are like mentors who help the newbie coders to become good coders themselves. Without those good coders here the 'newbie coders' will be putting out a lot of sloppy code, which will eventually upset the vB customers using it, and that will eventually give this place and vB a bad reputation. Good coders here aren't "just" good coders. They secure the future of this site. A lot of you here are probably too young to remember what happened when UBB was all the rage. They disrespected their coders too, and just like here, the good coders all left, and soon afterward so did all their customers. It is said that you can do one of two things with history; you can either learn from it, or you can repeat it. I certainly hope that vB doesn't repeat what the higher-ups at UBB did. I think treating the coders here with a little more respect is a win-win situation for everyone here. First of all it keeps them here where they belong, and doesn't force them to start their own sites. Secondly when vb.org is strong, so is vB the product, at least in the paying customers eyes. Thirdly, when the coders put out good free hacks and support them here, that gives more vB customers reasons to come here, which ultimately makes the vB camper very happy. Yes this could be a win-win situation for everyone, but first everyone needs to take a deep breath and realize that compromises on both sides need to take place before any real progress can be made. Best of luck to everyone involved

[Brad]

Personally I do not see a problem with users wanting to help out by coding things for this site, I think it's a great idea and would move things a long faster then the way we do thing at this moment. Perhaps we could set up some sort of dev area that people can visit if they wish to help out, there they can submit code or make changes to existing code if they desire. The only problem with that is security issues, so it couldn't be something that was totally open to everyone.

Forum layout: There are plans to re-order the forums, but it keeps getting put off for one reason or another. I agree it's messy right now and it needs to get done.

Donations: If someone wants to donate I don't see a problem with giving them a button to do so. I know a few people already include a paypal link in their threads now.

Finding hacks: I agree there are issues with finding hacks sometimes. It's really a issue with a lot of things, the search engine tends to give you bad results and the layout we use now doesn't help. Not to mention that layout has changed over the years many times and threads have been moved around.

Giving coders more: I think we should do everything in our power to make them feel welcomed and appreciated. Coloring their username sounds fine to me, as we already give you a title anyway. However I think that is just a gimmick to be honest and won't improve much. Maybe we could pick certain modifications and have someone write a review of them and interview the author. As it stands now the only way you'll ever get on the front page is by having a hack with a lot of installs or winning hack of the month.

The modification 'system': I agree this needs to be improved and has needed it for awhile. One thread just isn't enough for most modifications now, no matter how many template edits and little additions we add to them. What I've always wanted to see was something like sourceforge here. Give the authors a place for users to report bugs to them. Keep multiple revisions of that hack, have a place to release beta versions, separate feedback posts from support posts, have an area for multiple authors to get together and work on a common goal.

[Revan]

Originally Posted by Brad

Giving coders more: I think we should do everything in our power to make them feel welcomed and appreciated. Coloring their username sounds fine to me, as we already give you a title anyway. However I think that is just a gimmick to be honest and won't improve much. Maybe we could pick certain modifications and have someone write a review of them and interview the author. As it stands now the only way you'll ever get on the front page is by having a hack with a lot of installs or winning hack of the month.

I agree that coloring the username isn't going to make all of this go away, but IMO it isn't a step in the wrong direction

[hambil]

And let's not completely avoid the big elephant in the room - a commercial hack area.

[Brad]

A commercial hack area is Jelsoft's call. I'm sorry to say but that is out of my hands and has been for some time now, perhaps when Wayne comes along he can respond to that request for you.

[Roms]

Some posting guidelines for members asking for support to modifications is sorely needed as well. A little "Please" and "Thankyou" for all the support and work on modifications goes a long ways. Much more respect for coders is needed and needs to be pointed out to the members more than ever...

Originally Posted by Brad

The modification 'system': I agree this needs to be improved and has needed it for awhile. One thread just isn't enough for most modifications now, no matter how many template edits and little additions we add to them. What I've always wanted to see was something like sourceforge here. Give the authors a place for users to report bugs to them. Keep multiple revisions of that hack, have a place to release beta versions, separate feedback posts from support posts, have an area for multiple authors to get together and work on a common goal.

That's definitely something that I would be interested, I'm sure alot of other coders would be as well. :up: