I think I've had enough

[Logikos]

Same thing here Mephisteus. I was a newbie, but coders from the vb2 days were very helpful to me. They supplied the motivation that made me stay up for days and miss work, or school. All I wanted to do was code, code, code. If it wasn't for the coders, I would not know what I know now. I might have went else where to get my information, but nothing is better then getting info for a script directly from a offical site.

[Brad]

Thread moved to site feedback.

[Logikos]

Thank you Brad.

[hambil]

Yes, thank you. A good start on open dialog I think.

[Scott MacVicar]

I've read all the posts here, it did take me a few hours between other tasks and now I have to say I agree.

Things have changed a great deal in the last 4 years since I became a Jelsoft employee. Originally vBulletin.org was run with an iron fist by Chen, Bira and myself, coders were treated with a high respect by customers since PHP was still this large confusing language that no one knew. The community was also much smaller, a large percentage of the hacks were all written by a handfull of people.

Now in my opinion it seems that vbulletin.org might be a little understaffed from the modifications site and unable to implement all the suggestions that people make and those people who bash coders regardless of what they implement are completely out of order. I think a zero tollerance policy could solve that, though maybe the problem could be the way vbulletin.com sends customers here.

I'll speak to Wayne when I next see him since the majority of the proposed things would need discussion between everyone involved before they were implemented, a chat could be an appropriate starting point between Jelsoft, vBulletin.org staff and the top coders.

Maybe some coder appreciation could be shown with free t-shirts

[Revan]

Top coders? What do you mean by this? Master Coders only?
Im not trying to start something, believe me I am happy that you are willing to take this to the appropriate authorities, but I am wondering where you draw the limit on who gets to discuss that.
I feel that seperating the coders and members is a necessity, but internally seperating the coders leads to a sort of respect hierarchy where ultimately master coders feel superior and might start to look down on adv. coders and coders.

I apologise if I brought that part way out of context, Im just wondering if I could get a clarification.
Yeah, I am worried about not being in the cool club. Sue me.

[hambil]

Thank you Scott, and to everyone who had a hand in defusing this and opening discussion.

[Logikos]

Scott, I'm really happy to hear that. Not that talking to Wayne part, the T-Shirt part! Just kidding and all joking aside though. I'm really happy to see that us as a community has started to reach some of the Jelsoft staff with the situation on hand. Lets hope this issue can some how come to a positive ending.

[The Geek]

Thanks for the post Scott. Personally Im for bumper stickers. But then again Im in the camp that thinks a bumper sticker is a cure all (which says a bit).

[Brad]

I always hate to see a member leave this community, it doesn't matter if they are staff, a coder, or just your everyday admin. Many of them don't even post to say goodbye, they just silently fade away never to be heard from again. I think this is the fourth thread I've seen like this in my four years in the community, many of these years spent as a member and not as staff.

There is a lot of talk about how this site is going in the crapper, and a lot of people dwelling on things that happened in the past. Instead of dwelling on these things and fighting with one another we need to look at the bigger picture: improving vBulletin.org.

Now to improve you have to go about things in a certain way. You can't decide to 'go on strike' and expect staff members to jump because you said jump. When you do thing like that you make me feel like I'm begin bullied into doing whatever it is you want done. Even if I did try to improve things based on what has been said so far I'm at a lost for exactly what it is you want.

The correct way to go about this is to discuss things in a positive manner, in other words act like adults and realize that while you may not agree with someone, they have an opinion and a right to make it known just like you. This is not directed solely at members, or coders, it is directed at everyone here including staff members, Jelsoft employees, and Jesus Christ himself if he decides to stop by and make a post.

What we have to do is move passed all this negative thinking, so lets try to steer this thread in a direction that will benefit this site and it's users instead of causing more drama. So if you have a suggestion let me hear it by posting here, or in the site feedback forum, or send me a private message if you'd rather not post it in public. I will listen, I will respond, and I will do everything in my power to make the changes the membership requires.