European Union (UE) is it a good thing?

[UKBusinessLive]

Shelley, I'll be dammed if you don't stand as an MP so i can Vote for you

We may laugh and joke about the whole system in the UK here, But in all seriousness the Brits are getting mega pee'd off with working like donkneys and all our taxes squandard by those that have not contributed anything.

In the UK we have a new Citizenship test, for imigrants wanting to settle down in the UK and gain British Citizenship and a Free British Passport, Mugs like me, who work and pay taxes have to pay ?77, and have a day off work (?120 loss) to go for a bleeding interview to prove i am who i am, and i was born here lol

Its cool with me, people want Free citizenship, Yeah fine, but they need to Sign up to the Army as they are understaffed and Fight for their new Country, in afganistan and Iraq. I wonder how many people will be on the first flight out, Solving all our Imigration problems in one hit!!!

EU, No thanks, We survived as an independent nation for hundreds of years why break the habit of a lifetime.

If Shelley Doesn't sign up as an MP, then perhaps i might do !!!

[students_forum]

Originally Posted by Shelley_c

I can't even complain more about the EU. I agree with basically everything UKlive said and more. 75% of our laws coming from Brussels and it's a wonder why (speaking of britain) has gone to the dogs.

That is not an explanation. I do get tired of explaining how the laws of the EU are made.
Basically, the European Parliament is at the center - the guy you elected to represent you.
They decide

Originally Posted by Shelley_c

Like I said, it was a case where I wanted the conservative party to be elected because they were always against oining the EU. Tony blairs (labour party) mistake was folding to Brussels demands in joining.

oh dear!
We (the conservatives) took you into Europe, we signed the Single European Act, and the Maastricht treaty.

Originally Posted by Shelley_c

I'll say what I said about 10 months ago, the economic good times are over we lived through them.

The only countries the EU benefit are these countries that had no economic growth from the start which are a step up from these 3rd world countries. How could the likes of Romania and their neighbouring countries be accepted I'll never know because it damaged Britain greatly.

I cannot walk into a shop or make a phone call to services without being on the phone to a foreign person who I cannot understand. Because they work for cheap labour, it's stops jobs that were created meant to be for the countries residents to begin with. [/QUOTE]

This basically a nationalistic rant. You dislike 'foreign' people who go abroad and you don't understand them. You clearly haven't seen the British in Spain and Portugal!

Jobs are available to anyone who can do it. End of. If certain groups of people (more statements backed up by nothing) are more economic to employ then that is how business flows.

Originally Posted by Shelley_c

War veteran - Injured during the fighting in Iraq, Afghan, forget any kind of compensation You'll be screwed, we'll give immigrants the great benefits but if you fought for your country you are screwed to compensate for these bums entering. And when they do enter, they are protesting and throwing objects, jeering at our soldiers. Pffft. Ridiculous.

Rubbish. There is no indication that EU members have thrown objects at a soldier ... this is ridiculous. You quite simply dislike foreign people and will blame the EU.
You forget that the UK, Ireland and other European countries were once the bums that relied on the US!

Originally Posted by Shelley_c

Edit: The UN however, Are/where put there for a reason. Do we wan't another country invading another European country? Look what happened in world war 2. Bosnia. At least, that is serving a purpose. Soldiers are their to protect it's the guys who pull the strings in government that have their personal agenda that are the scums of the earth.

What does this have to do with the thread!
I take it you hate the UN for letting in those horrible scum immigrants who want to improve their lives! I have to admit, this does have a hint of BNPness, as opposed to conservative views.

.....

Right, now that I elliminated a good few "The Sun" based arguments against EU membership, it is in interesting to note the arguments for the EU. I am sure we have all heard the "its a globalised world, we need to be in a group", afterall the EU is the biggets economy now. There are hidden benefits. I am an EU law student, so I'll name a few:

1) The prevention of indirect trade barriers.
2) The enforcement of free-trade against governments and the free movement of businesses and workers.
3) A way in which businesses invest in the UK to get inside the EU area, because once you produce in the EU you can export anywhere in it without paying a tariff. We couldn't achieve this outside the EU, because countries would pick and choose the goods on which they have tariffs, fragmenting the market.
4) Getting rid of out-of-date and unjustifiable laws. Such as the privacy laws in the UK.

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Originally Posted by UKBusinessLive

If the UK was not in The EU, I can't see it not trading with EU countries??

Americia is not in the EU and we sell alot of Americian Beers here, Costa rica, where nearly all of our bannas come from is not in the EU, So i doubt that the EU can tell its member states don't trade with the UK because its not in the UK, If it did it would be a dicatorship and not promoting free trade.

Alot of our UK laws now come from Brussels, These laws are letting imigration get out of control with people citing the "Human Rights Act"

The Human Rights Act is one of Labours biggist mistakes, Here in the UK we have a system of legal Aid in which the Goverment helps out with legal fees for those that cannot afford a Lawyer or Solicitor (Attorny) Now with the Human rights act, legal aid has now costing the UK Taxpayer over 22.5 million GBP

With cases such as rapist amd Murders using the Human rights act to get out of prision early etc..

Blair only agreed to this as his wife is a Human Rights lawyer who was set to make ?????, if it became law, So far, it help Murders, rapist and terrorists escape justice. Did you know the UK has one of the Highest populations of terrorist, wanted by other countries but allowed to Stay in the UK because of the Human rights???

I'm not at all keen to let my country be a safe haven for the worlds worst terrorist, who if not in jail are living on benefits and housing provided by the UK taxpayer.

Gordon Brown for Years kept begging Tony Blair to let him be Prime Minister and one of his Promises was that we would have a Vote on whether we the UK taxpayer will want to Join the EU, and Lose all soverignty and our money.

If I had the Choise of Chosing The Queen, Our Currancy, and Our Indepenance against a corupt EU, Their failing Euro, and That lying prat Blair, I'd know where my vote would be

Although I don't post a lot on this site, I do find you amusing and interesting here but these views are rather disappointing. It is imperative that everyone is given a fair trial with an advocate (if appropriate) provided. Innocent until proven guilty, after all! That is one of the many traits of this legal system that make me truly proud. The Human Rights Act is the only legislation where UK citizens' are enforced by the courts pro-actively - where the judges had the power to condemn an Act as 'incompatible' if it breaches our rights. This has nothing to do with Blair (or such youtube conspiracies) but with empowering ordinary citizens.

We already lost our sovereignty the day we joined the EU, the referendum you speak of isn't going to change anything at the end of the day. Also, you say we lost sovereignty but the reality we all have a say in the future of Europe. You vote in MEPs who in turn sit in the European Parliament. Here the EP consults all the other bodies with regards to legislation, so in effect nothing can happen without the consent of Parliament (the people we elect!). So unless you have anything more than the usual moan about banana legislation (which interestingly shows a lack of understanding of why the EU even exists), then we do in fact have our sovereignty.

I have yet to see how the EU, as a whole, is corrupt. That is a rather substantial allegation to make!

Originally Posted by RedeemedWarrior

serves the purpose for which it was really created, but doesn't do anything Good for anyone

It's all a big conspiracy!

[RedeemedWarrior]

It's all a big conspiracy!

either that or extremely predictable
Bible (yes outdated relic of a book to some of you) predicted its arrival near 2000 years ago.

Predicting a revived Roman empire, while Rome was still alive and Kicking

I don't see a need for the EU, we don't need a bunch of Liberals from france, germany and the "suck up to Islam incase we offend some ethic group" EU countries to make our laws.

I have nothing against anyone due to their color of their skin, i have friends of all colours, Culture and religion?, heck yes they live in our country they live by our culture

[Shelley_c]

Someone needs to go back and read their books. Your responses are poor and need re-written possibility re-evaluated. Was this from a prediction survey? I'm not a racist I have plenty of non english friends I associate myself with whom are hardworking people who didn't abuse the system although this is one of the golden rules immigrants do exploit in the British system and manchester is seeing a vast increase in immigrants lately. I'll scream racism, I'll exploit a loophole and get my voice heard and increase the debt and limit the resources on silly matters where it would have benefited someone who greatly needed it.

I'm not even going to quote any of your other responses because that would entail me to venture to other sources and prove to you when obviously your not really living in the real world. All I can say is bury your head back in your books and even try to venture out. you cannot see any exploits from joining the eu? and/or people suddenly flocking here since their country got accepted? hmm I can see a little biased here and an element of narrow mindness and choosing to ignore the facts

I brought up the UN because the thread starter brought it up in the first post.

Your quite amusing though if not damaging to the economy. I'm sure we will debate more thoroughly throughout the day but let me wake up first.

[lasto]

Originally Posted by students_forum

We (the conservatives) took you into Europe, we signed the Single European Act, and the Maastricht treaty.

You just confirmed what everyone already knew - the conservatives are t******,but so are labour and the Libs - all out for yourself.

[Marco van Herwaarden]

A heated debate is no problem as long as it stays civilised and not result in personal attacks.

Please keep this in mind.

[GSeybold]

I can't remember but was the EU voted in by the people or did the government decide on their own?

[lasto]

Originally Posted by GSeybold

I can't remember but was the EU voted in by the people or did the government decide on their own?

well i never got a vote.They would`nt ask the people anything because they know we would`nt approve it.

[students_forum]

Originally Posted by Shelley_c

Someone needs to go back and read their books. Your responses are poor and need re-written possibility re-evaluated. Was this from a prediction survey? I'm not a racist I have plenty of non english friends I associate myself with whom are hardworking people who didn't abuse the system although this is one of the golden rules immigrants do exploit in the British system and manchester is seeing a vast increase in immigrants lately. I'll scream racism, I'll exploit a loophole and get my voice heard and increase the debt and limit the resources on silly matters where it would have benefited someone who greatly needed it.

I'm not even going to quote any of your other responses because that would entail me to venture to other sources and prove to you when obviously your not really living in the real world. All I can say is bury your head back in your books and even try to venture out. you cannot see any exploits from joining the eu? and/or people suddenly flocking here since their country got accepted? hmm I can see a little biased here and an element of narrow mindness and choosing to ignore the facts

I brought up the UN because the thread starter brought it up in the first post.

Your quite amusing though if not damaging to the economy. I'm sure we will debate more thoroughly throughout the day but let me wake up first.

Oh I see, so because I am an academic, I am going to get the "go-back-to-your-books" remark, which lives up to the stereotype that academics live in books and have no world interaction. How childish!
I do like the bit in bold ~ not only did you not present any supposed 'facts' () but I actually smiled to myself when you made the remarks of narrow-mindedness.
I provided you with an all-round-view of the benefits of the EU (including the more obscure ones) and all you are rambling about is the increased immigrant population in Manchester (which I can sympathise with) but that is hardly a sufficient reason to leave the EU. So unless you have a new and interesting (although I have heard all the eurosceptic arguments before) argument, I am also more than happy to indulge.

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Originally Posted by lasto

well i never got a vote.They would`nt ask the people anything because they know we would`nt approve it.

In an ideal world, they should have a vote ... but the reality is that most of the electorate are at best too uninformed and worst too thick. Period.
During the week of the MEP elections, papers had Susan Boyle's latest break-down on the front page. That is what the electorate would rather read about.

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Originally Posted by GSeybold

I can't remember but was the EU voted in by the people or did the government decide on their own?

What do you mean, in the UK or generally?
Well it went through an Act of Parliament ... that is how constitutional issues are done in the UK. Unlike Ireland, where their bizarre constitution requires a referendum for everything.

--------------- Added [DATE]1249441043[/DATE] at [TIME]1249441043[/TIME] ---------------

Originally Posted by RedeemedWarrior

either that or extremely predictable
Bible (yes outdated relic of a book to some of you) predicted its arrival near 2000 years ago.

Predicting a revived Roman empire, while Rome was still alive and Kicking

I don't see a need for the EU, we don't need a bunch of Liberals from france, germany and the "suck up to Islam incase we offend some ethic group" EU countries to make our laws.

I have nothing against anyone due to their color of their skin, i have friends of all colours, Culture and religion?, heck yes they live in our country they live by our culture

... and the British Empire ... which makes me so proud!

[Shelley_c]

You haven't really provided anything that is beneficial to the british citizens from joing the european union. Have you benefitted in any way? I would say you have which anwsers a question which you failed to answer.

The only people who are befitting from the uk joining the eu are the floods of immigrants that are enjoying the perks of our country and the freebies that are handed to them on a plate.

What gives a immigrant in this country to get priority from using the nhs and medical services over a britain that has paid their taxes and national insurance contributions? foreign nhs workers who cannot speak english and because they wouldn't not understand sit there looking dumb whilst a patient is dieing in pain because the medication they got is the wrong one.

The difference with me and you is that I remain to be realistic and see the downward spiral this country is going were you ignore the real life issues and want to quote documents and maybe even look at surveys/statistics that have been manipulated by the government for their own agendas. Who's the narrow minded one? You'll find that you face that person in the mirror every morning.

It's got nothing to do with your academic credentials but rather your stupidity. Try walking out the door and opening your eyes.