Hack Tracking Log -> list of hackers who support it
 

OK, I've spoken with several dozens of hackers over the past month, many have asked me how many hackers have said to make HTL hacks, and many others have been saying that they will make HTL hacks, most of 'm exclusively.

So instead of constantly answering "well, I don't know a detailed number but it's growing fast!" all the time, I figured I would just make a thread here and keep a list of ALL hack makers that have agreed to support the HTL - either exclusively or in general (ie. normal and htl releases both).

If you want to support the HTL by saying that you will release HTL-compatible hacks (exclusively or not, either is fine), please post your name in this thread and tell me whether you will go HTL-exclusive or both. Thanks in advance. :)


Here's the INCOMPLETE list, in alphabetical order.

dan
Dark_Wizard (exclusive)
DarkSSJ3 (exclusive)
eXtremeTim (exclusive)
Hiall (exclusive)
KuraFire (exclusive)
LeeCHeSSS (exclusive)
Link14716 (exclusive)
M|th
merk (exclusive)
Natch
Rein Masamuri
TheAnt (exclusive)
TheComputerGuy
trafix (exclusive)
..you?
..probably most of the 50+ people who have the HTL installed right now and are using it.



Non-hack related supporters:
(includes people of whom I'm not sure they will release HTL-hacks)

21productionz
Austin Dea
Bane
C.Birch
Darth Cow
evil
Faranth
msimplay

Does it really matter who supports it and who doesn't? What's the point of this thread.

What Chris said?

Yes, people keep asking me about what hackers are supporting the HTL. This thread allows them to see for themselves, and gives others an easy way to keep track of what people releasing HTL-hacks.

And you were one of the people that asked me (several times even, I think) what people were going to support the HTL. :p

I asked you yes, out of mere curiousity, I didn't mean for you to create a thread for it. ;)

I know, but you were by far not the only one who asked me, and a public location is just so much easier for people....

And it saves me a lot of time, too. Time I can spend on improving the HTL and making the Modules Manager, for instance ;)

kura,
You previously stated that you are doing this for "the community". If this is true, you would probably get more support...
If you add these options for hackers:

• Create .htl installer
• Create standalone installer
• Create .txt file
• Create ALL of the Above

AND ...

• the abilty to view all content (files/templates/phrases) to the end-user - I'm not talking about what the author wants you to see ... I'm talking about EVERYTHING.
• the ability to NOT save hack data onto the server (I think this is a waste of space.) - I would rather have the htl read from each .htl file if and when needed.

listen to my reasoning before you go off on your ranting...

1. the end-user (the members here) will have a choice
2. you will enable all hackers with a choice
3. no one would feel that they are forced to install your htl
4. no one would feel that they are forced to accept "your standards"
5. the .htl will be more widely used

If you do all of the above, everyone will SEE that you are doing this for the better of "the community".

You made a great hack Kurafire but i think that you are 2 obsessed with it :D;)

My opinion: I want a normal txt file by the hacks, this is the way we always had and if hack authors wants to add ht files with it then fine with me.

I would, but you have to understand that I'm not a magician!!! I can't make several weeks worth of coding in a day!
I already made a Create .txt File option for the HTL, and am awaiting vB.org to respond to it - if the .txt made by the HTL is sufficient, I will release that version.

A standalone installer is at least a month's worth of work, cos creating ready-PHP code in PHP code while also doing a LOT of intricate things inside that all.... well, it's just not easily done in one's spare time.



The first can already be done, though if you mean you want to read out the XML files into an interface, then yeah that's the only thing we can't do with it yet, and I will try to look into making that possible (but vB3's functions can't be used for that, so I'd have to write my own xml parsers entirely for that, that === more time once again).
The second is a good idea, and I'll look into adding it. Like... you upload the .htl from your harddrive to do a (verbose) Test run of it on your HTL. That would ensure that:
a) your database will not be touched
b) you get to see what each step does
c) you don't have to upload any files to the server yet, only a temporary upload from your harddrive to test things out.


Would that be sufficient? If not, what more do you want? :\



The new feature `Make .txt Installer` alone will already take care of those 5, so I guess I'll be releasing that version soon. Would that please you? :)

I just want to say one thing to you, Lesane :)

Your Store Hack for vB2 would've been so much easier to handle with the HTL. You would've loved it and be obsessed with it too had you had it back then, with this functionality. :)

But like my post above said, I may well release the new HTL with the text installer, soon.

I'm just making suggestions.:)
XML files can be parsed and printed using opensource XML PARSERS. There are a few out on the market that do a great job. You will not need to do anything .. just add a place (upload file input) to the htl interface to upload/parse the xml file.
The output can be modified to fit your needs. This can be added within a day.:up:

that's good but I would rather have no data inserted into the database ... for example, if there needs to be a vbulletin upgrade .. I can go into the htl and check for hacks installed. The htl will get the information from the original .htl file NOT from the database ... storing the information into the database is not needed.

the txt installer would please me ... but you have to think of the BIG picture. If you enable a "standalone installer" feature you will have a great piece of software that everyone can use in one form or another.

PS. I would also recommend an easier way for hackers to create a "temporary phrase file".

And I appreciate it a lot, thanks! :)

True, though I may be done faster using vB3's xml functions and just cutting out all the query stuff. They already have otag/ctag/etc. functions that I can still use :)
Anyhoo, not too difficult, true, but still some more time.

It's much easier and more flexible and useful though. The .htl files are not very accessible for a single purpose. They are 'compiled' hacks in their entirety. To do a thing like List All Modifications from .htl files would require the HTL to parse each .htl file it can find, which takes a lot of time, and use only a little bit of data from each...
Also, for the creating of hacks, not doing it via the database is very complicated and just not worth the trouble, imo.
2 simple tables won't hurt anyone, they're not intensive, have very little overhead and they aren't accessed a whole lot either. :)

I would also be defeating the purpose of the HTL - to create one structured, balanced Hacking Standard for vBulletin. A standalone installer is just too much work and redundant to boot - the HTL itself works fine. Sure, "people should be able to use the hack without having to install the HTL" - but where's the harm in it? If they don't want the HTL, I should not be forced to do overtime for them. And with the text file installers it can now create, people have their way anyway... :)

I've looked into it, but so far the only alternative I can come up with is one that will only complicated things, require a lot more explanation, and cause more confusion than is necessary....

It takes a bit of getting used to, this new method, but after a hack or two you'll find that it works quite well and easily, after all. :)

I don't think anyone is asking for an installer that edits the PHP files. That in itself would be a nightmare. If you want greater acceptance for this then what you need to supply is already coded.

1. The HTL allows hack makers to create XML files. It also imports those XML files. This import/exporter should be released as a standalone installer. Then the same XML files can be used for this as well as the HTL. All you have to add is the ability to optionally run the queries. The only real difference is that it doesn't log all the changes in the database.

2. You say you added a text instruction, this can list the queries that need to be run and the modifications to the the PHP files. It can also add text at the bottom informing the end user to import any XML files using the above hack.

3. The Forum front-end portion should be a standalone add-on separate from the HTL. This allows only people who want to install that overhead whether it is 3 templates and a query or 10 templates and 100 queries.

Really it is just a repackaging of what you have already, doesn't require any new knowledge and in the end gives people a freedom of choice which currently isn't possible.

Not exactly, what people have been suggesting on top of the TXT files is the HTL to generate a standalone installer.php that will do _exactly_ all the things that an HTL-installation would do, but without requiring to have the HTL installed.

So basically, it would create a large .php file that imports stuff etc. etc.

I don't plan on making something that actually edits .php files on your server - I don't like that, and I don't want that, and many people don't want that either :)

More to it than that, though. The HTL Install Routine somewhat depends on the HTL environment: many many functions for taking care of it all. To make that stand-alone would require all those functions to be added (but first rewritten partially) as well, and then you have the HTL just without the database logging or the many many benefits.

The HTL lessens the need for file edits: it automates menu links and template groups. A non-installed standalone installer/importer/utility would not be able to do that.

'cept that there is no standalone importer, and I don't know if there will be one either. If vb.org's staff is satisfied with the text installers that the HTL creates now, then there is no real need anyway.

The front-end has no influence on hacks at all. It only lists to people what hacks YOU as vB admin have installed on your board, AND have specified to show up on the front end to begin with. That's all. If a hack requires 10 templates and 100 queries, it will require that with or without a front end.

But I'm considering making 2 versions of the HTL: With front end, and Without front end. People then download the one they want, and if they don't want the front end and choose that version, it won't have the (10 or so) front-end phrases, the 1 front-end setting, and no templates.

It's a little more complicated than just a repackaging though. :(

It's great hack, and the point of this thread is to let users know the name of the hack author who will create HTL compatible hack for future reference, it's very informative thread.

If you don't like it, then don't read, rather than ask for the "point". Obviously your question is pointless.

im neither going to be for it nor agasint it, if the problems are fix i will also release htl installs if i see fit

Kura - you can put me down as exclusive - there are text file based installs for two of my hacks only because I had already made them - all my future hacks will be HTL only.

EDIT: Well, if you make it create .txt files, I'll release them as well for the people who feel like doing 10x the work...

Thanks Link :)