Add more Tax to cigerettes?
 

Should we increase the tax on cigerettes?

Normally I would say no, it's your body, your business but taxpayors are paying millions out in healthcare cost of these smokers so yes!

Also, if a person is on welfare, on public money, they shouldn't be allowed to smoke as they'll also be on public medicine as well. So I'm paying for the person to get sick and then paying for their hosptial bills? Yikes!

Preventable conditions cost us so much money when we could be spending this same money on finding cures for conditions people do not to do themselves.

Thoughts?

Gabby

I smoke and I support it.

Nobody should be refused healthcare. I'm not a smoker. Taxpayer or not, if a person ineeds that operation they should never be refused. If the thinking goes your on welfare, you smoke so you shouldn't have to pay for the healthcare then we shouldn't be paying for childrens healthcare. Afterall, they aren't working, paying taxes.

Luckily, we don't live in a world like this and healthcare should be available to everyone and anyone. The root of all evil is money. If we dig deeper, should we blame the companies who produce cigarettes? should they foot the bill for getting people addicted in the first place? Stating in the early days when smoking was good for you?

The real truth is the goverment need people to smoke as much as a person needs to breathe. There's so much money in it for the government they can tax the hell out of it.

Do you drive? I'm wondering how many drivers have polluted peoples lungs with the gasses they emit.

They'll always be a time when someone won't be able to work (maybe this is down to health problems) and rely on the state for some kind of income. Does this make your contributions less grudgmental (Not even sure that's a word but I like it and it fits what I'm saying). *Submits to wiki*

I don't care if they charge 10$ a pack :D
anything that helps me not smoke is top notch in my books

I agree, not only the price is a good reason to quit, but there are a Ton of other reasons to quit smoking

Was I talking about refusing anyone healthcare Shelley? No. What I was saying is to make them pay for it. You driving analogy is ridiculous. Most of the world HAS to drive, no one has to smoke. An apples and oranges analogy. Why is it that so many people on welfare can afford to smoke? I can't. Yet, the people I'm supporting can? Ah, ok. I don't think so.

I'm not a smoker, i don't mind.

Most of the world doesn't have to drive, that's a load of old cods wallop. Just as much as the people who smoke don't have to do just that, smoke. I forgot your an american. I think your healthcare system is backwards especially for a country well developed as it is. If i'm understanding you and I am quite sure that I am. Your last thread (or a previous thread of yours) points out on large families on the whim you thought that they were recieving handouts so your thought of thinking (even though you haven't typed it in as many words) is transparent.

I can certainly relate to what your saying, I don't agree with it though. If you think what I say is ridiculous think of the world it would be if the goverments of the world adopted your training of thinking. There will be people who work hard all their lives and when they need the help they simply won't get it while someone who doesn't work (bone idle son of a b) will receive all the handouts they need, Including healthcare. It's the way of the world. In my opinion, nobody should go without healthcare no matter if they have inflicted the disease on themselves or not simply because they haven't worked, are coloured or any other factor that you think they should have to pay for it.

In the uk we pay national insurance contributions to the nhs funding and this ensures that the healthcare is freely made to everyone. Whether or not, they are on welfare, working or simply taking drugs that the training of thought that these people might not deserve it.

Simply because you didn't type it in as many words doesn't mean I didn't know where your coming from. Your previous threads are a big giveaway on your thoughts about people who are on welfare, receiving donations which is well within your right to vent. That doesn't mean it makes your views anymore ridiculous than my car analogy which wasn't actually an analogy but a comment.

Why so many people on welfare can afford to smoke? Honestly, I couldn't answer that question. If it were me, I would ban smoking altogether and leave the smokers of the world go cold turkey for a few months. Then, the goverment would only tax something else, Like the air we breathe. Purchasable via bottles.

Nice words Shelley :)

The thoughts behind the tax on the tobacco products is to pay for spiraling cost health care in the US. They hope the tax in effect makes people quit. They don't want people to smoke. The cost for people to smoke outweighs any taxes they will ever receive from it.

I am all for the taxes we pay if they go to things that are useful, like the health care the overseas countries have. If we had little or no taxes, nothing (or less then now) would get done.

cigarette tax ok

about welfare, nothing wrong with it - someday you may find a family or friend on the receiving end ... things do happen

I heard some talk about "drug tests" for welfare recipients. I think it's a good idea but gov't will need to bring the costs down for doing these tests. It's not worth it if it's going to cost the program a lot of money.

Said nothing about welfare being wrong... and I have been on the receiving end of it and used it for ESSENTIALS. I was referring to.... If someone on welfare can afford to by cigarettes then they can afford food and Rx. Period. Welfare was established for one reason, to help in a time of need, to help feed, cloth and house families or to help someone who is physically unable. It was never intended to be a lifestyle in ANY country nor was it ever intended to subsidize smokers, women who continue to have baby after baby, IVF or not. Hard working taxpayers whether it be US or UK, watch their hard earned money be used for cigarettes, junk food, women who have eight babies and so forth. Enough is enough. There are probably hundreds of thousands of people who actually NEED welfare, children not getting medical care.... but all these smokers using these resources, absolutely not. Individuals on welfare CAN stop smoking, oh but I suppose taxpayers are going to have to pay for that too, instead of taking any type of personal responsibility and quit on their own? Same with fat people on welfare, sorry, we shouldn't let anyone using food stamps buy hostess products and potato chips. Just perpetuates obesity>diabetes>increased medical expensed for tax payers, whether it's here or the UK. I want my tax dollars to go towards immunizations, children stricken with terrible cancer, abused women... not cigarettes and junk food.... it's just perpetuates this mess and relieves many of these individuals of responsibly. It's a very bad cycle and unless society starts to hold people accountable again, this will just get worse. Seriously, at what point does society regain some sort of personal responsibility again? At what point do we as hard working taxpayers, say NO you cannot smoke if you're receiving welfare? Shelley, doesn't it bother you that right now as you read this, some beautiful innocent child is suffering from cancer but can't get treatment because the have no money but the person on welfare is on their third hospital admission this month due to something preventable like emphysema caused by smoking? Doesn't it bother you that a woman who makes ONE mistake and ends up pregnant, needs taxpayer help during this difficult time, but has to jump through hoops of hell to get it but then some scumbag, plastic surgery ridden psycho has eight children on California's dollar? Doesn't it bother you that some 300lbs welfare person is on their 3rd hospital admission this year due to diabetes complications after spending your money on ho hos and soda? The sad thing, people don't want to look at this reality for whatever reason. Why is it that people on Welfare in both the Uk and the US are often fat and smoke? Oh yes, I've heard the education argument a million times before. Enough with that, how about saying NO, this isn't ok anymore. It isn't ok for millions of hard working taxpayers to wake up every morning, shower and head out to a job, probably both parents, struggle to put food in their own children's bellies, can't afford health insurance for their own families, and then hand someone a blank check for cigarettes, hostess cupcakes and free medical care for PREVENTABLE diseases. Our society should be taking care of innocent children, life threatening cancer, abuse, the starving and homeless NOT lifelong takers who have often times made it an art to get through and stay in the "system", get those monthly checks, cash it, buy cigarettes before they a gallon of milk, buy cookies before they by apples.

I AM on disablity for a condition that is probably going to end my life and I've had to jump through a 1000 hoops to get it after I've paid perhaps several hundred thousands into this system for these types of people. My condition is obvious, you can see it but you know why I've been treating this way and why so many others have been treated so poorly when they really ACTUALLy need help and can't work? Because of people like the above. I've had it and have seen enough.

your anger is directed to the wrong group

- get some facts before you voice your opinions

(please keep opinions clean)

:eek:

Anger LOL no just disgusting. Get your facts right to Princeton.
Clean? I said nothing that wasn't clean. It is quite difficult reading the truth isn't it?

If your attempting to tap into my emotions you failed before you even typed your first word. Have you ever been in a hospital of children suffering from what your saying.

Firstly, I'll endulge you.

6 months ago my dad past away with only 2% of his lungs working worked hard all his life and never relied on state benefit. In a space of a month he was turned away, operations canceled prompting a nervous breakdown. The last month of his life it was too late for them to operate and do any good he suffered from emphysema and basically left him to die. Now does it bother me? what good would that do? Think of the bigger picture, it's not the people on welfare who seem to bypass the queue who lives and gets operated on and who pays that don't get operated on your argument is directed at people on welfare benefits who have (in your case) seemed to have got a better deal, you are passing yourself over as a victim when you shouldn,t be discriminating against the people who obviously are on welfare that get a better deal than most which some of the time they do. I know they did in my dads case. Do I agree with you, no, I don't. Does it bother me, No. Get on with your life and make it the best you can rather than feel sorry for yourself.

Now you bring up children. Let me tell you something. the first 7 months of my brothers life he was diagnosed as having heart problems (I'll need to check up what the condition is) Glenfield hospital and I have seen 2 month old babies die in intensive care baby unit so your feeble attempt to affect me fails. There's nothing in life that bothers me in the slightest. You get on with it, and you make life what it is.

Like I stated, your healthcare system is crap, I'll listen to your points of view heck I may even laugh about them but agree with them I don't. The last thing we need is a hitler of the health care system deciding who goes up who goes down etc etc.

I don't mind telling you that your post is an attempt to tap into peoples conscious, Maybe it will but I'm not one of them. I've seen it all, been through it and will whole heartly tell you I still disagree with you contrary to the above.

Shelley, not to go off the subject but I've been to the UK, worked in the healthcare system there. They seem to have a better approach, IMO. You live it, you would no better than I.

P.S. About 15 years ago or so, I had a patient who was this very special little child. Not sure how to describe this child anther than being strangely angelic so to speak. A little less than two years old, was able to stand up in the hospital crib as he held on to the railing. The poor little sweetheart was in a severe S. A attack. He couldn't breath and needed to be intubated. We worked furiously to help this baby, we couldn't figure out why was it that every time we extubed this child and his mother visited he would go bad again. This little guy was in the PICU for weeks and both his parents continually complained about not having any money and were on welfare but obviously had a severe smoking problem. As the weeks past, the staff noticed that the mother of this baby reeked off cigarette smoke more and more and that every time she held the baby he would have severe difficulty breathing. The baby was finally discharged and the nurse walked the family out to their car in the usual hospital fashion. The woman strapped her baby in the the car seat, rolled up the windows of her very nice car and lit a cigarette. The baby returned a few hours later reeking of smoke and in cardiac arrest. We resuscitated him again and of course this little guy was admitted. He was stabilized and return to the floor a few days later. The mother walks in, reeking again of cigarette smoke after being told numerous times that this was the cause of her child's breathing problems but told us that her smoking was none of our business. In the infinite wisdom of this hospital social service staff, they did not take action. The child was released in the care of his mother again and died about 2.5 days later in my ER after suffering a cardiac arrest from cigarette smoke. So taxpayers paid for these cigeretess more than likely... are taxpayors responsible for this child's death or are the parents? I'll never forget this patient as long as I live.

What I will say is that every day for many years I witnessed this abuse of taxpayers money when other medically needy individuals sat on the sidelines and died. Very sad in deed. Denying medical care to ANYONE is inhumane, not insisting on personal responsiblity is another story.

It's an unfortunate incident, Like I said, I can certainly relate to what you are saying because I was in a similar boat such as yourself. It took watching a child to die in front of my eyes (many children) to dictate the person I am today (some will say a pain in the arse which I'll most probably agree with). We can't blame your situation, on anyone person. We would need to go back in time and point fingers at the makers of cigarettes, distributors tv advertising cigarettes and promoting smoking. You'll have to look at the bigger picture in these situations, obviously the parents of this child just couldn't give a crap, they should be shot. But that doesn't deter from the fact that it's a whole chain of factors that results in these unique situations.

I will say I don't mind agree with you that the health system in the uk surpasses that of the american healthcare system. Social services on the otherhand (which in the case of this child) they should have been brought in for child neglect. If I'm reading this right, why didn't you report this neglect to the social services if you knew this child was suffering and needed care each time he/she become better in health each time he/she left the hospital.

Maybe the topic is going off-topic a little but it's your thread so it's only fitting you have the right to dictate what direction it's going which I don't think anyone will mind.

heh i just quit smokin havent had a cigg since march 5th and i have ALOT of $$ to spare!so in that cash UP with 20$ cigg packs

I recently quit too, about the same date
good luck to you :up:

thanks loco good luck too you aswell

Increasing the price won't help. Look how expensive alcohol is and that doesn't stop people going out and drinking it in large quantities. Ultimately it's a culture thing. It's cool to smoke, it's rebellious to smoke and it feels good. Cut that aspect out of society and people won't do it :)

More of the problem of this is a moral issue then money. If you could drug test ($30) a welfare recipient, have them fail, and get kicked of welfare we would save, literally, millions, if not billions.

the issue really is, how fair is it for the little child of a crackhead welfare recipient. mommy got high and now they have no food, then they go into the system, which open another huge can o' worms...

there are a few states with pilot programs like this i believe AZ was testing the water of welfare drug testing.

there is no perfect answer i think to the problems we have with welfare.


on the cigarette tax, screw you non-smokers! :P

we are being taxed, HEAVILY, and it is not with the intent of "helping us quit" OR "paying our future medical bills" it is to put tax money into the government coffers. It is messed up, imagine of there was a federal $1 a gallon tax hike on gas, imagine the uproar that would create.

they should not look at smokers or drinkers or anyone other 1 group as cash cow, it is messed up IMO.


ETA: Governor of Delaware, who sucks, is hitting me hard......

extra tax on people making over 60k a year
extra tax on cigs
extra tax on alcohol
my wife, a state worker, is taking a 8% pay cut AND her health care premiums are going up.....


THAT HURTS.

I agree with dean, smoking for teens and earlier (heck, I seen 6 year olds group together smoking away) think it's super duper cool to smoke but I tend to look at it in the long run. Whilst for the first 5-6 years it may become cool to smoke the person soon regrets it (in the mature age) and finds themselves in a situation where it's not so cool to smoke, but rather they rely on it and haven't got the willpower to give up. Addiction kicks in and the government could tax and raise the prices of cigarettes as much as they can and it wouldn't make a blind bit of difference. Well, not enough to make an impact on the masses, they might reach out to a few select people but the masses will continue.

Because I'm a regular at one of the 2 major heart hospitals in the uk I seen alot of people who have been brought in to have heart bypasses performed on them and they have still got the bandage where they have still been opened up on and still need to be stitched up (waiting for another operation and still they are outside having a cigarette. Adding more tax and/or raising the prices again will not make any difference, the growing issue for some people of people on welfare or otherwise will still bombard our hospitals needing major operations to the point the nhs and the private sector are at breaking point.

If someone has the willpower to give it up after so many years well done to them but the impact on those few will barely touch the problems of over crowding in hospitals and/or for the majority to give up educing a never ending circle of problems both for the people treating them and themselves.

Not sure about this thread it's taking some twist and turns and each response seems to be different from the last so I'll end by saying sorry for the bad english, I'm english.

Raising the taxes on on cigarettes will never get someone to quit, but lowering the price on alternative methods for quitting should.

Have you seen the prices of some of those items that can aid in quitting? Lozenges? Gum? Patches?

They cost just as much as cigarettes...so why quit?

From a smokers point of view no. From a governments point of view.. HELL YES.

I'm a smoker and if the increase is warranted then do so.If i can afford it by buying it, then I'll do it till i can't.

Adding more tax to cigs may curb a select few from buying. However, the biggest spin off is illegal importing and distributing (crime). The government tried it here a number of times, and actually to a large degree still are. People are going to smoke, it's an addiction. In reality, it's very difficult to take any decisions the government makes seriously when it is revenue based. "Don't smoke it's bad" but if everyone stopped and all of a sudden all the tax revenue stopped, I can guarantee there will be some very unhappy reformed smokers. ;)

im not happy with your post.
With the tax that people pay on cigarettes they should be getting free private healthcare.
Yet u on about not giving them any care at all.Remember without the tax from cigarettes the goverment would recoup the money from elsewhere and proberly hit u in the pocket as well.

Now what about people who drink - should we tax them as well more because we all know that alcohol puts a burden on the hospitals.

What about fat people - maybe we should introduce a fat tax on the food they eat in prder for them to eat less.

The list goes on and the only people who benefit are the goverment.

Leave smokers alone - we pay enough in tax.(Yes i am a smoker but thats my personal choice)

hahahah "fat tax" the United States will be rich :eek:

ROFLMAO - Fat tax, that's one to remember. :up: :D

Down with ciggaretts.....ban it for good and legalize teh erb 8))))

at least is more healthy then ciggs...

Someone actually really did the math on smoking in the USA, and if counting everything, the conclusion was that each package of cigarettes sold, still benefit the community with $0.30. That is after calcualting all the extra medical care for both the smokers and those who inhale secondhand smoke, but also the "benefit" of the smokers dying younger, saving a ot of medical care.

Forget the $0.30 - over in the uk we pay about 3 Pound tax on every packet of cigarettes so on my smoking alone that equates to about 30 uk pounds a week.
Now try telling me i could`nt get private healthcare for that amount - esp if u look at it monthly.

Also not all smokers are a strain on the nhs - some are i admit but not all.
Lets take drinkers - hospitals are full of people who are attacked when people go drinking over the weekend etc - does this not put a strain on the nhs ?

Whats killing the NHS is not its inability to cope - but the strain it has been placed under since Britain opened it borders and allowed anyone in.

I'll admit lasto joining the eu has put added pressure to the nhs but the strain was there long before we joined the eu. You make a good point that it's not just smokers, It's not you are right about that but this thread is focusing on tax on cigarettes. Not binge drinkers, nor drug abuse users who some people feel put additional strain on the nhs.

The biggest strain on the nhs is the goverment, everyone no matter if they are foreign, abused their body or any other factor that warrants some people to say they are strain should never be turned away. It's all too good people put their 2 cents worth in and pointing fingers but they have not been in the situation where they are waiting (as i stated in this thread). Yes, the nhs is overloaded, it always has been and it's increasing each day.

If it's not smoking, it'll only be something else. If the patient (waiting list) goes down we only see funding to the nhs decreasing keeping it at that breaking point. It's one of those vicious circles which will always be present within our countries. It pays to die, or atleast the government. A person who has worked all their life and not working (due to retirement) is only a drain on society as far as the government are concerned. you could fight for your country and when you need help you'll be shit upon.

Anyway, looks like the original poster has abandoned this thread. Controversy and leave other members to battle up it's what I call the puppet string effect. Get dug in.

double/triple the tax. I don't care. Smoking is a waste of money full stop. I hate it when people smoke around me, I shouldn't have to breathe in that crap. There is not a single positive that anyone can justify for why smoking is good, and there are so many negatives against smoking which is why the government should up the tax, make some money from the people that are too weak to give it up.

look ok

I am going to set all of you straight. I dont even have to read anything anyone has posted.

STOP SMOKING. I DID. THats right, Im an eX smoker. BLING BLIGN

So heres how i did it.

GET U THE GUM itS THE BOMB. I quit like a champ. whoop whoop

btw what country are you in and what is tax?

The evidence is surely there.

Ya know, to people who smoke cigarettes, at least all you have to worry about is a tax. What about non-violent medical cannabis consumers, or even just casual consumers, who have to worry about jail time? That's another debate for another day, though.

On a socio-economic status, I agree with the heavy taxation of cigarettes. It really sucks, but every US citizen has to sacrifice something in order to live here. Cigarettes are not a necessity, because it is possible to live without them. Plus, they've been proven to caused a myriad of illnesses. Sooo... in the interest of public health and economic welfare, why not make the luxury that kills expensive? Sounds like smart politics to me.

nothing worse than an ex smoker who claims if they can quit then everyone can.
Maybe we dont want to quit - hows that for an answer.
The thing is we pay a lot in tax on cigarettes yet u lot are saying we should be paying more.
Well i dont agree with your view either.
Without us paying tax on smokes u would be hit harder in the pocket simply as.

Also do u drink alcohol ? waste of money if u ask me as i dont drink but i also dont want more tax on alcohol just so i can spite all you drinkers.
The only winners are the goverment - no one else.

see bad view again ........smokes are not the only thing bad for you - what about the old favourite [B]?lcohole/B]
More dangerous than smoking a cig - do u see people killing people and saying i dont remember it because i was under the influence of a cigarette ?
U dont see the police policing smokers outside factories do you yet they have to police outside pubs because of the amount of trouble that alchol brings.
Then we can go onto how much does it cost to keep all these drug users in their habit ?
Or what about Foreign Nationals coming to this country for operations then going back to their homeland - its all a strain

Even if i was to give up smoking tomorrow i would still not agree on increasing tax on smokes.Their is a lot of other groups that should be hit first.
Thats the problem with us lot - we all split into different groups baying for the other side to get crapped on (once again) - Instead of standing up and saying No More we had enough.

Addiction VS Willpower..... Who will win???? Ohh and the 3rd runner up, do what I wanna do by Lasto ;) - Tune in next thread, same style of question different context for the answer!

:p

Looks like a smoke off is on the cards.

Granpappys cough medicine is so cheap and people will rarely drink as much as they smoke. In this day and age smoking and drinking the mixture goes hand in hand. My own view, I don't think the government could get away with taxing the hell out of alcohol like they do with smoking cigarettes. The average user who chooses to drink alcohol will simply give it up whilst the average smoker is addicted after a certain time. And, unless your a raging alcoholic, this would be the small group who would continue to purchase alcohol if tax on the mixture were raised to the extreme amounts that the smokers endure.

It will never happen (esp here in the uk) cigarettes are in another league that the goverment can capitalize on more than they ever could with alcohol.

Not really raising any points that anyone didn't know already.