Should I delete Thread?
 

Hello all,
I have a question about deleting a thread. Recently I have had some of my frequent posters starting threads, on how they can go about "legalizing marijuna." And how they would like to become Marijuana reformers.

They are also talking about what they do with Hemp, and Cannabis.

What are your thoughts? Should I delete this thread. You can read what's being posted here:
http://www.lacledeforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=214

I posted a statement saying that I would not endorse the use of any of these illegal things. But, I am just stuck on whether I should delete it or not.


~Michael

I dont see why you would delete it. Its just a discussion? No ones actually trafficking anything or doing anything illegal?

I'd only remove it if it were becoming hostile. Users do not like censorship, no matter what the topic.

Michael,

Its up to you mate, your the boss, if you feel that it goes against the general feeling of the site then do it, or if you country's law forbids it then delete it.

In some parts of the world, its a minor thing, and in come countries like Holland they actually sell it in coffee shops.

In the UK the law was downgraded a few years back, but its still an offence to buy it and to have it on you, if the Police see it they will take it away.

Do what you feel will be in the best interest of your site ;)

Imagine if any of your members where also members here : what would they think of this thread where you are asking for advice.You would lose respect as you are there admin and as such should be able to make decisions yourself.
If u feel the thread should be closed then close it.
Ive read some of the thread and i dont smoke the crap but from what i read they not doing anything wrong - talking about it is not illegal (at least not over here anway)

GREAT! Thanks for the input. Seems my little disclaimer set well with the posters. I think I will just leave it at that. Thanks again for your input though.......

Just a side note: They really sell it in Coffee Shops in Holland.....who woulda thunk. lol

Sounds Crazy but its true, http://www.coffeeshop.freeuk.com/Grey.html

How can the country function when people get off there heads all the time :D

They don't get off their heads all the time - they leave that for the tourists and then laugh at them.

As to censorship etc, I have a strict no politics/religion/controversial stuff rule, but I also maintain a second forum for debates of that nature, and I send people there. It's a slightly pricey solution, but even though I am actually censoring in one place I'm giving them opportunity (if they want to take it) to discuss it elsewhere.

For most, it's too much trouble, of course, but...

Rapscallion

DON'T DELETE IT, they SHOULD legalize :D

I have a very long thread about this for medical use only. )

Discussing the legalization of Marijuana or reforming drug laws is not illegal. In many states, there are already laws allowing the use of marijuana medicinally as long as it isn't involved in interstate transport (falls to Federal Jurisdiction there).

On the last November ballot in California, there was a measure that would decriminalize Marijuana use within the state. If failed but only by a small margin. If passed, it would mean that California law enforcement would no longer prosecute marijuana cases and would have basically legalized the substance. California already allows medicinal Marijauna use provided that the product is grown within the state and the prescription is obtained from licensed medical practitioners. The U.S. Supreme court upheld this law when it denied Federal Agencies (FBI, DEA and ATF were plaintiffs) access to California State resources to investigate and prosecute medicinal marijuana cases in the state unless interstate or international trafficking was involved.

There are already some areas in California where local law enforcement doesn't actively prosecute personal Marijuana use. The costs involved up through and including possible incarceration do not provide an active benefit in reducing crime in the area. I suspect the ballot measure decriminalizing Marijuana will be back on the California ballot in due course. Eventually it will pass. Whether other states and eventually the Federal government follows though remains to be seen. Personally, I think there are better areas where law enforcement can spend their dollars and legalizing and controlling the sale of this substance would increase government revenues.

It would only increase government revenue. Same in the netherlands. Our "coffeeshops" (the place where you can buy marihuana) have to pay taxes like any other business.

You can have up to a maximum of 5 grams on you as this is considered for personal use. If you have more (or trying to sell) then it is not allowed.

This is interesting Marco, Where would the "Coffee Shops" Buy their stock from??? From a shady looking bloke in a BMW or from approved goverment sources ??

Can you just sit inside a coffeshop and smoke all day long??? and has the european ban on smoking in public places damaged the businesses that depend on this type of thing??

I would assume that a lot of sales go under the counter so to speak, i can't see these shops declaring everything, can you ??

:cool:

Good question,but i doubt it very much as the world is full of druggies.
Its true what they say about Marijuana,thats its a soft drug on the ladder to other drugs such as cocaine and Heroin.
Ive had friends who started off smoking that crap and now they Drug Addicts.No longer friends either cause who wants someone,who would rob of their own family as a friend.

The system in the Netherlands is far from being without major flaws.

A coffeeshop may have up to 500gram stock. An individual may have up to 5 grams for personal use. This is not legal, but it will also not be prosecuted (it is tolerated but not legal). The growth is still illegal (allowed up to 3 plants for personal use) so supplying the shops with stock is not legal (but police will not check). At this time it is a topic discussed by politics again. Some want to turn back time (ie. also prosecute the users), others want to make it really legal (including controlled growth and transportation). Until now they never dared to make it totally legal as they fear the reactions from other countries.

Yes a Coffee Shop will pay taxes and not many will try to fraud as coffeeshops are monitored all the time. If they would sell to a minor, they would loose their license after 1 or 2 offences.

There is no european anti smoking law, but most european countries do have such law these days. In the Netherlands a no smoking law became active last july for restaurants and bars, this officially includes coffeeshops. But a lot of them allow smoking inside again.

Some pages on wikipedia on this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_po...he_Netherlands
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabis_coffee_shop

Yes in the Netherlands we make a difference between Soft Drugs (Marihuana, alcohol) and Hard Drugs (heroine, cocaine, etc..).

If you want to rank it, it would even be considered less dangerous/addictive/problematic then alcohol. It would make more sense to ban alcohol then to ban marihuana.

IMO, it would make more sense to ban many other drugs over marijuana. Alcohol, Tobacco, Salvia, etc. etc.

This is one of the most common myths about Cannabis. I have seen the same thing, but I blame it on the person and not the plant.

For most people, cannabis is a terminus drug, not a gateway drug. Users of high strength drugs such as heroin or LSD are also statistically more likely to have used cannabis in the past, but this is just toying with statistics; when comparing the number of cannabis users with hard-drug users, the numbers are extremely small - suggesting that there is no link at all.

I think in countries where Canabis is illegal, the chances of a canabis smoker switching to hard drugs is much bigger as they are both sold by the same dealer.

Ehh, I'm sure that it plays it's role. Having something easily accessible would increase the desire to try it, I'm sure.

I don't personally know a bunch of people who deal, only a few, but all of them deal strictly with cannabis and nothing more. I'm not suggesting that it doesn't exist, I'm 100% certain that it does. I don't know about how common it is though, as I haven't personally seen it in my lifetime.

I think age plays its part, if I had tried anything as a teenager I'm certain that I would have been far more vulnerable. My mind was young and I was very immature. I don't think I would have been able to handle alcohol or anything else at a young age without experiencing some unnecessary consequences..

There are a number of causes and reasons for bad things to happen if you try any drug. The blame can be put almost anywhere, really.. I'm not one to say that cannabis is good for you, by any means.. but there are FAR FAR worse things going on that people should be concerned about, and I think that for the most part.. harmless people are being punished over a pretty harmless drug.

I don't think its a harmless drug, Its very strong now and has been proved to cause mental health problems http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/drugs/Pag...isdangers.aspx

Great Reply's Marco, Thanks for that :D So, does that mean that the shops are allowed to buy via a drug dealer as opposed to some goverment source??

This worries me as there is no checks on the quality or safety issues

Interesting read. I didn't mean to make it sound like I thought it was harmless, hence "pretty harmless" being used. Any type of smoke going into your lungs will do damage. That being said, you can purchase a vaporizer which will eliminate almost all instances of harmful smoke going into your lungs.

The posted article states that cannabis is worse for your lungs than Tobacco cigarettes. I strongly strongly disagree. Only a very small percentage of cannabis smokers will smoke more than once per day. Far less frequently than your typical cigarette smoker. Also, with cannabis, you are not inhaling the many additives that go into commercial cigarettes.

There are also studies where marijuana smoke does not have the same effect on the bronchial tubes as cigarette smoke, so heavy usage may not cause emphysema.

I'm not saying it's good for you, at all.. but I do believe that it's pretty harmless if used responsibly. Obviously, you shouldn't smoke anything daily, or worse, multiple times a day.. just as you really shouldn't drink alcohol daily either. There are people who do it, and there are people who don't.

I would be ignorant to say that it doesn't cause some bad effects if you consume so much of it. There are instances of people consuming so much cannabis that they do suffer toxic psychosis. Normally, that isn't unique to cannabis, and it's actually very rare when looking at the large picture of cannabis users..

I hope I'm not coming off as a know-it-all, cause I don't. I am simply stating my opinion. Two months ago, if this thread were around, I would be singing a different tune. I was 100% uneducated on cannabis, and then I finally decided to study it in an attempt to be more open-minded.

I think it should be legalized.. aside from people being able to smoke it freely as they please (responsibly), the plant itself is arguably just as renewable as corn, if not more. I think it would do wonders for the down economy, it can be put to use as medicine, recreation, fiber, fuel, food (said to be the "new soy"), etc. etc. etc.

You need to get a new book and study more.Cannabis makes people paranoid (not everyone) but it can happen to anyone,regardless of how much they smoked.



Paranoia. Certainly the least pleasant mental effect of cannabis, though it is one you can learn to counter. Partly it comes about through the increase in heart rate (see below), which can cause a feeling of slight panic and dread if you are not used to the sensation. You will be more likely to jump at loud noises or unexpected bodily contact. Busy places can become difficult and confusing (like Amsterdam Central Station, for one). You may feel as if you are being followed or watched. In extreme cases you can really freak out over this: literally everyone will be watching you, and if asked, you can prove it. I am just trying to be as honest as possible. Paranoia is unpleasant, but is just a temporary thing and can be combatted. If affected too badly by it, just remind yourself that it is an effect of the drug and like all the others, will wear off over time. If possible, get yourself somewhere quiet to chill out; solitude is a good way to combat it. Or find something to concentrate on, like a calming or interesting programme on TV, or a piece of favourite music. It's usually better to acknowledge you are a bit freaked out than to try and brazen it out in front of others, which can often only make you more paranoid.



Case Study 1: Thomas Palmer

This habitual cannabis user murdered two school friends with a hunting knife and was jailed for life in March. The case raised concerns about the mental health risks of the drug.

Palmer was 18 when he killed the boys in an "explosion of anger" which left one of them with his head almost severed. During the incident in September 2005, he cut 16-year-old Steven Bayliss's throat and stabbed Nuttawut Nadauld, 14, on a footpath near their home in Finchampstead, Berks.

Palmer admitted killing the two friends but denied murder on the grounds of diminished responsibility, claiming he was in the early stages of schizophrenia. His claims were rejected by a jury at Reading Crown Court, where he was found guilty of murder.

The case heard from Philip Joseph, an expert witness for the prosecution, who said any psychotic symptoms were likely to have been caused by heavy cannabis use.

Although Palmer was not smoking the drug on the day of the killings, he told doctors that he had been using ''skunk'' regularly in the weeks before the killings and that he had attacked the boys when they tried to comfort him as he suffered a serious panic attack. He confessed to prison doctors that he was smoking cannabis daily by the time he was 15.

Case Study 2: Ezekiel Maxwell

A heavy user of powerful ''skunk'' cannabis, Maxwell was 17 when he launched a frenzied attack on Carmelita Tulloch, 51, as she walked to work in Kennington, south London.

In April, Maxwell was made the subject of an indefinite hospital order after pleading guilty to the manslaughter of the grandmother on the grounds of diminished responsibility. Psychiatric reports stated that at the time of the stabbing, in September last year, he was suffering from paranoid schizophrenia which was exacerbated by heavy use of ''skunk''.

After he handed himself in, Maxwell said he had been planning to stab a woman for several days but she had to be ''a black woman".

In a statement to Croydon Crown Court, he said: "I saw a black woman. I think I stabbed her three times to the front of the neck and ran."

His lawyer, David Hislop, said: "The defendant was trawling the streets armed with a kitchen knife, looking for a woman to stab.

"It was Mrs Tulloch's dreadful misfortune that she was the person he had chosen to be his victim. It was savage and brutal and without mercy.''

Maxwell cannot be released without the authority of the Home Secretary or a mental health tribunal.

Ive yet to hear about anyone murdering someone because they where under the influence of a normal Cigarette.

How so? I ask because what you just posted is pretty much exactly what I have stated.. It's not good for you, and if consumed heavily there can be long term negative effects.

Paranoia, anxiety, panic, fear.. sure, those are all common side effects of a new smoker. The side effects pass, and they certainly don't become permanent. Just like alcohol.. I don't know about anyone else, but when I first started drinking.. I was very paranoid. I still do get paranoia, but for the most part, it has passed.

The "tar" that your quote speaks of is resin and it's... true. When Resin is smoked, it's usually when the smoker is in a desperate state of mind.. which isn't responsible to me, and that's something that I personally don't agree with. From my experience, the desperate smokers are the ones who get called "addicted".. the ones who seem unable to function without it. Addicted or not, they're uncommon too.. compared to say, alcoholics, pill poppers, etc.

Again, I'm not saying it's good for you.. but look at what else is out there that IS legal. Cannabis is just constantly slandered by silly rumors that have spread about to put fear into society.. "It's a gateway drug, it's addictive, etc" (which are both arguable), where as some of the most addicting drugs out there are perfectly legal.. Guess what is 100 times harder on your body, 100 times more addictive, and 100 times more of a gateway drug for Americans? Medical prescribed pain killers.

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For real? You haven't heard of the millions of people who currently suffer, or have died suffering from second hand smoke? Babies born addicted to nicotine, not fully developed, asthma, lung cancer, etc etc.

So a guy smokes a bowl before he commits a crime, and now that's WHY he did it.. Guess how many people smoked a cigarette before committing murder. I'll guarantee far more.. but I wouldn't blame the cigarette, just as I don't blame cannabis. I blame the person.. there's obviously far more mental issues going on in their head than most people could even fathom.

But the difference is,the person does`nt say `well i killed them because i was under the influence of a benson and hedges cigarette` do they ?

You can legally Drive while smoking a cigarette,the same cant be said for smoking a reef - wonder why that is.

I agree with you Lasto, The Police in the UK take just as serious a people driving under the influance of drugs as they do alcohol, Great thing about cannabis is that it stinks and you can smell it a mile away.

The Mental Health Issue is also a worrying fact, especially since its been proved in the UK that Cannabis is responsible for a good majority of people that have mental health issues and have are still are smokers of cannabis. :eek:

Just like alcoholics, they will never admit to having a habit or a problem to them everyone else is at fault not them. Like you lasto, I know people whose lives have been changed by cannabis, One was a good school friend of mine that now i want nothing to do with him, He stole from his grandmother to fund his habit and spend a good portion of the earlly 1990's in and out of prison for such petty things. Such a shame

You shouldn't drive under the influence. Ever. That's not using it responsibly. Same exact thing with alcohol. There's absolutely no justification for it, ever.

You're entitled to your opinion, and I respect it as yours. I am able to see the millions of lives lost due to commercial cigarette smoke as apposed to the amount of deaths caused by marijuana. I am able to see the millions of lives lost due to drunk drivers as apposed to marijuana. That's what I'm trying to get across as my point.. It's pretty harmless.. when compared to what else is out there, and I think that we should be putting our time and money into something that is a much larger concern to human life.

I would vote to legalize cannabis, and make tobacco illegal. 100%. In a heart beat. No second thoughts. I believe that far less lives would be taken, even considering that not everyone will use it responsibly.

Cannabis smoke should not be legal publicly, and neither should tobacco smoke. People should absolutely not be allowed to smoke in front of their children. That makes me so sick to my stomach, I can't even imagine what is going through their heads when they do it.

Amen to that!

See...people discuss it all the time. Hence this thread.

I feel like the discussion is going to happen no matter what. As a reporter said about Michael Phelps on the TV today...

"if you have never taken a huge bong yourself, you know someone who has"

I'm glad the laws are getting softer in the US...rec pot smokers should not be filling our jails imo.

It really shouldn't be illegal. I don't smoke it anymore...but I see no real issue with it being controlled..

Even the Shark smokes pot... why should it be illegal?
Ban pot = ban cigars/cigarettes = ban booze = ban part of fun?


P.S.: I don't smoke cigars/cigarettes.

The Netherlands has a much lower prevalence of drug use, than restrictive countries.