Don't know how to code, is vB still for me
 

I recently joined AdminZone Forums for help figuring out basic costs of starting up a forum to determine if it was feasible for me to do so. Their members determined vBulletin was the software I should purchase if I ultimately decided to go for it. The issue of coding never came up during the decision process wherein which all I did was share features of interest to me for starting up a not for profit educational forum. I have been reading threads here where members are discussing coding. I don't know how to code anything. It was my understanding I would purchase the vB software this coming September and it would be installed on the dedicated server and from there I would begin to learn how to use the software to start up a new forum. I signed up for the demo and poked around at the vB site for a little bit. I felt overwhelmed but it seemed as if it would be doable with patience and time. My experience to date has been as a forum member making posts certainly not as a forum owner/webmaster. Am I going to be able to handle this type of software with such a limited (non-existent) skill set as in no coding knowledge at all?

I decided to go for it. I'd really like to try for an educational forum. When I registered the domains I needed for the new not for profit a few days ago and associated educational discussion forum, the owner of the dedicated servers I selected also provided a service where customers could elect to choose him as technical contact for the domains. I chose him. Seemed like one stop shopping to me and he certainly has forgotten more about computers than I've ever known. He stated he would install any forum software for me that I purchased for no charge- very kind of him. I'm most pleased with his generosity as it is doubtful I could install much of anything but would both of us be able to use this support forum with two different e-mail addresses? I will be the one purchasing the vB software and the license however it was my intent to end up being nothing more than an end user/webmaster. After reading some posts here, I can see where it may be important for both me and my dedicated server provider to have access to all areas of this site. Is this possible or would I need to purchase an additional key or something in order to enable him to receive support here also. I really don't want to purchase two licenses when I will only have one forum just to be in a position to allow both of us to receive assistance and guidance here. Come to think of it, he would be the one who would need to have access to the add-ons/plug-ins to download them while I would need to have access to the forums to learn how to use them. Eesh, dilemma.

Who normally backs up a forum? The webmaster or the provider of the dedicated server who installs the software? Presumably vB has a means by which to back up all settings and data incorporated into their product. If not, is there another product that has to be purchased at the same time to back everything up? If so, what is the cost please?

I notice in comparing software that vB does not have archiving. Pardon my ignorance but what is archiving and why would one need it. Is there some sort of an add-on/plug-in for archiving if one determines down the road that one needs this feature? Seems to me as if vB has every imaginable feature under the sun and then some already so is this some sort of a feature that is a duplicate of another feature already present in the vB software but called something else?

Well, you seem to have thought this one through. As a licensed customer, you can specify up to three email addresses for priority support to gain access to these and other official vBulletin sites. Installing vBulletin is simple for most, but there is an option for Jelsoft to install it for you.

Also, vBulletim has capabilities to back up your forums, more robust systems are available, and most hosts can offer schedule back ups. It depends on your choice. You may want to use the Admin Demo found at vBulletin.com to further test the software.

I can't code either. The install files are easy to follow and installing mods are very easy. This is still for you.

I was handed a vbulletin site, about 3 years ago. I knew nothing.
I barely knew how to turn on a pc, let alone run a website.
I had no clue what I was doing. But, I learned.
I now have 3 vb sites of my own & countless other sites.
vbulletin is the best I have used. It is well worth the money.

You have thought a lot about the technical maintenance of your board. I doubt however that this will be the biggest challenge for someone that only used forum software as an end-user. You will probably find that running the community as an Admin will be your biggest challenge.

How much technical knowledge is needed will depend on your own wishes. vBulletin already has a lot of default features. Most of these can be tuned to your liking by setting the options in the AdminCP (Administrator Control Panel). Besides the initial installation (limited knowledge needed), you don't need a lot of technical knowledge. If you want to add more features then the default vBulletin installation will give you, then you will need to install a modification, which might require a bit more knowledge depending on the modification. All modifications available at vBulletin.org are always free of costs.

You can add up to 3 additional email addresses for full support forum access to each customer account. This will give them licensed access to all official websites.

In the end it is the responsibility of the board admin to ensure a good backup is created. Very often the host will already backup files and databases on a regular basis, contact your host about this. vBulletin does not have a buildin reliable backup option. There are however many 3rd party utilities (mostly free) that can assist in creating a backup if this is not fully covered by your host.

Archiving used to be used to reduce storage and processing and would offer a leightweight version of an original. With the current processors and the low price of storage this has however became mostly obsolete. vBulletin only stores the full version of each page.

Yes, I am trying to think this through to the best of my ability. I don't particularly want to rush through just to get a forum up as that most assuredly could spell failure. I did use the Admin Demo provided by vBulletin a few days ago. Good to know I can specify up to three email addresses for priority support to gain access to support.

What is the fee for Jelsoft installing the software for my dedicated server/host man? He's been so kind to me that if there is something I can do to make his life easier, I'd like to do so... if it's affordable. Oh how I wish I had a money tree out back to hire people from this site to do all this "technical" stuff!

fattony69 and blind-eddy, your comments meant the most to me. Thank you for taking the time to reply here. Should mention I don't know anything about HTML either. If you two want your laugh for the day, I just found out that the acronym HTML did not stand for Hotmail but for hypertex markup language. I do know how to cut and paste as of the recent past so that would be a step in the right direction.

Would it be to my benefit at this phase to spend time at sites such as this-
http://www.w3schools.com/html/
http://www.lanw.com/html4dum/h4d2e/html4du2.htm

Bet there's a coding for dummies site out there somewhere too.

Any other sites someone could recommend that might be able to provide me with a basic understanding would be appreciated.

As far as the installation of modifications, presumably somebody here would be able to talk me through the process or I would be able to use the search feature for that particular modification to be able to try it on my own? I have thought about this and it would be my intent to add the few modifications I have an interest in before the board is made available to posters. My thoughts are that if I screw something up... worse case scenario is that I re-install the underlying software. Would I be correct with this thought process? No time like when there are no members to experiment and screw up royally. I tend to learn more from mistakes than I do from reading about how to avoid them.

Regarding the unavailability of a built-in reliable backup option for vBulletin, thank you for your candor Marco van Herwaarden. I personally would not have appreciated learning about vBulletin's deficiency after there was a problem. Let's discuss third party utilities please. Are there threads here where they are identified and discussed? If not, would those reading this thread be so kind as to provide me with the names of these products and a brief synopsis of how they could work for me? I'm not necessarily looking for a hand out so if there is a third party application out there that is superior for backing up that isn't free, I'd most probably be amenable to paying for it.

It would appear archiving is obsolete. Thank you for your explanation.

vBulletin is completely fine if you don't know how to code, and in fact, with the modification system, the best forum for those that don't know how to code. You can edit anything easily through templates, the colours, fonts and other stuff can be edited through the Style Manager options with text boxes and previews and images are as simple as overwriting the existing ones.

Oh, and modifications are extremely easy, because most are simply either importing an XML file or a line or two changed in templates, which means no need to know PHP or how to edit the actual files, and anyone can do it. Heck, even styles can be imported the same way, as can language packs.

As for backups... there is an option in the Admin CP to create them, although it's not recommended when your board gets to a certain size of database. And the install files are easy enough to use, just edit the annotated files, upload, enter details, click ok a few times. vB does not require a great deal of technical knowledge to use therefore, so you'll be fine.

I agree with all the comments above. You have put a lot of thought into your decision and you are making the right choice by far. Obviously we can't make the decisions for you, but we can only offer our support.

Like Marco said, there are a lot of options in the Administrator Control Panel which will simplify your life. It's quite easy to get your head around things when you get the hang of it. Jelsoft do offer an installation service but I am also sure that you can find a coder on here to install it for you a little cheaper. It's a nice smooth easy job :)

Mods are the easiest thing to do, all you have to do is upload files and import a product and it is installed. There are a few that require template edits, but all this is listed in a readme file that comes with the mod, so its easy to follow as long as you read it all the way through and follow what it says.

You do not need to be a coder to use vBulletin. I say go for it ;)

I learned most everything I know about coding from adiminstrating a vBulletin forum. And it wasn't because I HAD to learn the things I did. I just felt compelled to see what more I could do with the software. Ether way, I got my money's worth.

Most of our users will install vBulletin themself, even those without experience in installing webbased software. We do offer a Professional Installation Service ($150.00) but we mostly encouraged users to install on their own. This will make the user more knowledgable and will make it easier in the future for the user. If needed you can always rely on our support ticket system to help solve any issues that you might encounter during the installation (or the use of vBulletin). You always have the option to purchase the instalation service at a later time or hire a third party to perform the installation for you.Not having a decent backup option inside vBulletin itself is not so much of a deficiency, but more a choice. Any webbased backup solution is prone to problems like timeouts during the backup. Non webbased solutions are often operating system dependant and thus less usefull in generic software. Also most host already offer backup services and the database software (MySQL) also comes with backup tooling for the database (the most important part of your backup).

You can read more about manual backups in our manual: Backing-up your MySQL Database Manually

Had already determined if I was to “go for it” that I would be purchasing the vB product over the IPB product. Admittedly had some misgivings about starting a forum at all after I began to read thread after thread here about coding and HTML. The vB product will be purchased as soon as I’m incorporated. Not interested in wasting time reviewing software other than vB any longer.

Appears the most reliable means by which to back up is described here-
Backing Up The Database via SSH/Telnet
http://www.vbulletin.com/docs/html/m...nce_ssh_backup

Other viable options may be-
MySQLDumper:
http://www.mysqldumper.de/en/index.php
MySQLHotxcopy:
http://www.vbulletin.com/forum/showt...t=mysqlhotcopy

I will leave the decision of how to back up to my server/host man. This is way out of my league.

I’ve been reading my notes from the AdminZone forums regarding management, privacy, and security. I’ve now taken the time to review vB's available add-ons for 3.7… all 23 pages of them. I have selected the following to start with and others can be added on an as-needed basis after I actually get the forum up:

vB Database Backup (in the event my host doesn’t allow SSH/Telnet)
https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?t=167276

Multiple account login detector (AE Detector)
https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?t=183268

Force Users to Read a Thread (want all members to read the TOS, PP, and rules)
https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?t=172155

Cyb - Advanced Forum Rules
https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?t=177559

NoSpam! for vBulletin 3.7
https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?t=183329

vbAnonymizer
https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?t=184267

Proxy IP to real IP conversion
https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?t=165483

Image Resizer
https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?t=176531

Separate Sticky and Normal Threads
https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?t=165550

Welcome headers - Improve community registration rates
https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?t=165519

Should anyone feel I have chosen poorly, please let me know. Should anyone feel I’m missing an add-on that would ease my forum start-up headaches, please suggest it otherwise I'll be back here at vBulletin.org in a few months after I deal with other issues.

And now that all this coding and HTML is behind me; I need to focus on working with the lawyers to incorporate then onto drafting a TOS, a PP, and basic rules for a different set of lawyers to review. From visiting active forums online, I have a few other concerns that I’m sure the good folk at AdminZone can help me address. From there I need to find a way to change the colors of the vB board to an earthy and light sage green and figure out how to get an eye catching banner up at the top with the name of the .org that looks some semblance of professional. There are other miscellaneous items on my to-do list but you all here wiped out any reservations I had about moving forward.

I thank you ALL for your guidance and patience. Admittedly I am not the type of person who would feel compelled to see what more could be done with the software and am totally relieved there is no need to be sitting through online HTML and coding courses for Dummies ;)

editing to add Digital Jedi's suggestions to my list above-

vBCredits - Ultimate Points System
https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?t=172399

AME (Auto Media Embedding)
?

Download Manager II
?

Changing colors can be easy enough using the style manager and the banner is a setting for each individual style.

NoSpam, and I think most of the admins who frequent here would agree, is probably one of the most essential in terms of curbing (not preventing) unnecessary spam bot registration. You'll still get the odd human user registering one of his bots, but for the most part, especially if you have a large active forum, this will trim down the spamming significantly. If you have a small forum like mine, it will virtually put a stop to it.

Use Force Read sparingly to get the most benefit out of it. But yes, definitely a useful one.

That's a very good start and will get you a good idea as to what installing modifications entails. After you get comfortable with your starting modifications, depending on your forum activity, also look into vBCredits, AME (Auto Media Embedding) and Downloads II (download manager.)

Reason I mention these three is, one, vBCredits is one of those things that can increase forum participation with your already active users, or encourage inactive users to participate more. AME is a media embedding modfication, which I admit, I'm a little biased on because I maintain an Add On for it, but would be useful for you in terms of adding video from various educationally themed video (form places like YouTube or something like 5MIN Life VideoPedia) with no need for uploading video and taking up space on your server and absolutely no need to teach your users how to use it because it converts video URLs in post automatically without need for BBCode, strain on your server or any effort on your user's part. And Downloads II is a useful one for giving your users a means of sharing files, such as PDFs, Word Docs or any other form of media which your educators could make available in a nice neat place, rather then using the attachment system where good files can get lost in tons of threads easily.

Also note, I'd say 99% of all modifications here all install in the same manner. Once you do two or three, you start to get the gist of what to do from then on. Basically, you'll seldom run into a modification that doesn't involve one or more of three basic actions.

Import through Product/Plugin Manager
Template Edit (eg. Find this line of code, add this Lind of code under it)
Upload Files

Beyond that, they're almost all the same thing. Do a template edit to your postbit three of four times, and it registers almost right away how that works. And if the "find this line of code, add this like of code under it" sounds tedious. vBulletin has a search feature in the template editors that searches through the code in a split second.

Also, and this is most important, never underestimate support at vB.com or vB.org. Yes, I know sometimes threads don't get answered. That's inevitable on a forum of this size. But that's the only reason why, and doesn't happen as often as you might think. People here are really more then willing to help, even in spite of the sheer volume of requests. But, ironically, because there's such a high volume of Q&A on this forum, you'll likely find the answer to your question multiple times by doing a site search.

NoSpam! shouldn't be necessary - the "question & answer" functionality is already implemented in vBulletin 3.7.

I beg to disagree with you Dismounted. The built in function is "CAPTHCA OR Q&A", while NoSpam provides "CAPTHCA AND Q&A" capability, which from what I've seen has been more effective then one or the other.

It is my intent to block all IPs from China. Sorry but I've read enough to know I don't want to deal with the by product of those cyber cafes. If anyone else has had the opportunity to visit that Country, they fully understand what is driving these children of the streets. It's nothing personal, just a means by which they can eek out a living at our expense. Anyone legitimate can contact me and I'll get help figuring something out. Others can deal with the NoSpam!

I only want Force Read for the TOS, PP, and rules. Possibly changes to same. Don't know. Will consider that at such time as there is a change to a TOS.

Yes, I spent time reviewing all add-ons more so to familiarize myself with what would be available to me. Wanted bare bones for the direction I want to go and it would appear I did ok in the initial selection process.

Yes, I found the Q&A here. Loved them and will be over in that area again and again. Those Q&A's here and at AdminZone are the reason why I'm in a position to communicate my needs some semblance of intelligently. You poor people would have been dealing with a babbling idiot were it not for Q&A areas. Most people don't suffer fools well.

Thank you very kindly for your suggestions Digital Jedi. Must think about vCredits but will add it to my notes along with AME. There will be quite a few users on dial up so I must consider their stress levels in using the site. Will need to learn much more about how to accommodate dial up users but am pushing that to a back burner for the time being. Would the Downloads II add-on be capable of handling a Power Point presentation?

Many thanks to all of you. I feel more comfortable with feeling uncomfortable about this whole start up process.

Yes, Downloads II will upload anything with the extensions you designate in the Admin CP. So you can add PowerPoint extensions (I forget what they use) and they'll upload, and by extension you can restrict files types simply by not adding a given extension.

As far as dial-up users go, the only time they'd run into a problem is if they loaded a page with a video on it, and that's only if it's from a site that auto-loads large files. I've done 150+ definitions for various media sites, and I don't know of one yet that does that. Most video hosting sites accommodate for dial-up users, and you'd simply be embedding videos hosted on their servers. As a former dial-up user, I can testify to that.

Powerpoint use .ppt :)

New it was something like that. I'm glad I didn't say what I was thinking (.pub), which is for Publisher files.

I edited the post that had my list and added all three of your suggestions. If you happen to know the links to AME and Download II, that would be great. Briefly looked for them and couldn't locate same. Wonderful to know that Power Point presentations may be added. Will work on learning more about making it easy for dial-up users to load pages in the future. That's very important to me. Don't want anyone left sitting at their monitor frustrated a page is taking for ever to load if at all possible.

Don't get vB man. it sucks. theres no shop mod. i got vB its a rip off. and i can do the exact same with SMF

google smf forums its free and much better bro.

The shop mod is under development. And I administrate two SMF forums. It's free alright. And you get what you pay for. No, you cannot do the same thing with SMF.

Based on your comments, I suspect you weren't in a position to read my posts in which I stated vB would be the software I would be purchasing. My decision is final. If you are in a position to share any knowledge or experience you have working with the software of my choice, it would be most appreciated however I have no desire to discuss other products. No product is perfect and presumably each has strengths and weaknesses, I fully understand that. I'll take my chances with the vB. I believe it has the best support and is therefore the best fit for me.

Incidentally globofan, I am a female.

Have a nice summer everyone. Must work on that TOS and address other issues, You've all been great.

TBH, both is a bit overkill. But that's just my opinion.
And .pptx ;).

I had to look that one up on the properties of one of my PowerPoint presentations. I believe I understand. My Microsoft Office Suite for Word, Excel, Access, etc is 2007. In subsequent releases of their Office Suite, they used an extension of .doc for Word but as of the 2007 Microsoft Office Suite, they began using a new extension of .docx. In other words, if I wanted to enable PowerPoint presentations, I'd have to somehow insert .ppt & .pptx somewhere so that members who are now working with newer versions would also be able to share their work. Would I be correct?

Would it behoove me to purchase this vB software right now so I could start plugging these things in as they arise and are fresh on my mind? Or, is there a way to bookmark my threads here so I can refer back to them in a few months? I'm concerned about forgetting all these little things.

I wanted to hold off purchasing to try to better manage my money by staggering what would be due and when. I believe there is a renewal fee to vB that is $50 a year to cover upgrades/updates and presumably that will be due on the anniversary of the original purchase date. I'm really trying hard to avoid clumps of little bills coming due in the months of July, August, September, December, and April as those are particularly horrible months for us. Not that $50 is unreasonable but we have some big bills due in those months plus all of our regular monthly household bills and all these little ones add up so darn fast.

Yeah, there's a field in the Admin Control Panel once you install Downloads II that lets you add the all the file extensions you want to allow your users to upload. It also adds permission based settings to your User Groups in case you want to limit the download/upload access to only certain User Groups.

I'm not sure if you have access to the Tag option under Modification Settings within the mod threads. It might be something you don't get until you purchase a license, but you can check. You should, at the very least, be able to add any thread here to your subscriptions list.

One of the nice things about vB is once you do buy a owned license, you have access to all the current upgrades for one year. But even once the year is over, aside from being able to run your forum indefinitely, you'll still have access to all versions of vB that existed up to the point your license expired. So you don't have to renew if money is tight when the license expires. You'll still have access to member support, both .com and .org forums, and any upgrades that where made available during the time your license was active. And that way you can wait until your in a better position to pay the renewal cost, and gain access to the most current versions that came out during the expiry period. So you might want to take that into consideration when holding off buying.

I lost the area that I found that was loaded with Q&A. What did I do wrong. I know I found it once and spent a heck of a lot of time reading in it and now I can't seem to locate that area of the forums. Link please.

Are you talking about our Articles sections found in the top tab-menu?

Sorry, I made a mistake. Some of the Q&A's were here within the articles and some were at the vBulletin.com site.

Dismounted- we have learned you were right on the money regarding the built in recaptcha feature as opposed to NoSpam for entry level 3.7.4 users. NoSpam may very well be the better option for earlier versions.

AME has been added however I'm not quite getting the hang of that. To a back burner with that.

We have some concerns regarding the FractalizeR: VBulletin Antivirus.
https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?t=187482
It won't be installed. Great concept and wonderful features though.

Are there any other hacks out there that are more stable that are capable of scanning attachments for viruses? OK to suggest one from a third party that charges a fee.
Although I did not understand what you shared at the time, I do now. Good information.

editing to add-
We did not install vBCredits. After careful consideration, we decided it was too much too fast. Not that it wasn't a great suggestion, it would have put us into a tailspin figuring out what the heck to do with it. Definitely something to add down the road. All the others, save the FractalizeR: VBulletin Antivirus, have been installed plus the miserable users hack.