I completely agree as well.

I understand for issues of privacy, if you don't want to publicly show code or what not. But still if you have the communication open, all parties can view the comments and you know who is liable in almost all instances, or who is at fault.

This is the only site I know of where they don't want commenting in the threads, and it makes no sense to me. But I didn't make the rules, so wouldn't know the reasoning behind it naturally.

I think though that when a job is going on, the only people on guru that can view the comments are the client and the coder, and the website owners obviously. Which kind of helps with the privacy issue as well since none of us could view the sections or discussions anyway.

This is why I am struggling to find a coder with acceptable portfolio to review. ...

Yea i just ate a bill from someone here, I did work for him on his forums, and he said everything was great, and that was the last i heard from him so it definently goes both ways...

I think it would be an amazing idea if you implement a system where:

1. Buyer/coder communicate, and the project is awarded to a certain coder. The price is decided.

2. The buyer "pays" the money, but it is stored in VBulletin's secured account or something, and it is not "released" until the coder finishes their work and the buyer agrees to release the money.
3. The communication should take place in a "private thread", however if there is a discrepancy in the end - if both parties agree, the thread can be viewed by a staff member. And for providing this safety feature/staff, VBulletin should get a certain amount of the $. (Like 2-3% or perhaps more)

Just my 2 cents.

the whole point of the system is having jelsoft/site staff as least involved as possible.

Many of the cases if people would have done a search, they'd find who scams and who doesnt, instead of blindly hiring people who seem best

There should be a system like on ebay where the people have possitive rep and neggative

I wish there was an official vbulletin site for paid hacks and paid jobs. A site with member reputation and escrow service. I have been thinking of starting a site, just for the need of it, but my time is sparse.

You are in the same situation as all the other guys here Alfa1, everybody wants one, but nobody have the time for it...

maybe if Jelsoft provide the approval for such a site, someone would be more willing to start it as it would be a guaranty of reliability...

Yes, I do feel that it would be best if Jelsoft would be involved to some degree. Just so that such a site would be administered in line with Jelsofts wishes.

I see iTrader has been mentioned a few times in this thread. Seems to me the most sensible a easily implemented solution.

iTrader is a good solution, but not on THIS_SITE... you see...

Urm, not really, no. :confused:

a buyer/sell rep system sounds good, but I don't like that ebay fell that means money being made has to be altered in order to pay the third wheel.

Sorry to tell but it needs LEADERSHIP ;)
it's all it needs now

leadership without a kingdom... hard...

I'm sorry, but I do not see that has a valid argument. For one, you're not a moderator so you have no say what is implemented here. Second, why isn't it a good solution for this site? What's so different about it? I personally think it would be a good solution.

I don't think it's the job of the staff here to police the request work area.
The user themselves MUST to a little research, and not just take the offer because someone said they can do the job for 50$, when any respectable programer would charge 200$ for the same work.

Like I said in my first post.. "if it's to good to be true" then it probably is...

and no, we don't need itrader at the Org

I keep hearing that we don't need iTrader. But I've yet to hear any kind of argument, plausible or otherwise, as to why not.

Yeah, it's wise to do research on anything, it isn't rocket science. But that forum is just so cluttered, it makes it difficult.

And explain why iTrader wouldn't be good at vbulletin.org. I have yet to see a valid argument. Don't say something if you can't back it up with claims.

it was discussed many times the reasons why vb.org does not need iTrader...

1- friends can rate anybody... there is no record system that implement itrader rating only for real clients that paid... on sites where Escrow is working, only clients that are into a process inside Escrow can rate coders. so just this point make iTrader useless.. you can ask your friends to rate you.

2- rating in these systems is based on opinions, not real facts... who can say with iTrader that the code is following vB protocol and is well written?! most clients do not even know what was installed in their site. they do not know if the coder have put a backdoor code or something, because the clients do not know vB code... and nobody can verify the work done.

3- rating coders by their contracts... already 90% of the clients in the paid services are not coming back when they have bad experience, so the bad coders would not be rated negatively anyway... same for positive ratings... most of the clients not coming back because they are satisfied and were coming on vb.org just for asking, not for discussions, so they do not care.

4- ... nothing else, i think that work with these arguements.

The guy who wrote the hack runs a very successful forum, so I doubt he'd out his own forums at risk. Of course, that doesn't mean there's no faults and he's a brilliant coder. But surely it would of been removed if it was potentially dangerous?

Well, you can basically do that with any system, really. Same as eBay. But, it's better than nothing.

You guys sure to like to let your emotions get in the way of discussion. Anyway...

Nexialys, each of the points you've made can essentially be made about eBay's rating system. I can get my friends to rate me there as a good trader too. It's all opinion as to whether service was delivered satisfactory or not. And not everyone is going to rate me; good or bad. Those points alone don't discredit the essential value of eBay's rating system.
There's just one fundamental flaw in your logic there. Unless I've got a massive amount of friends who happen to be vBulletin license owners, this is not going to majorly tip positive ratings in my favor. Unless, of course, you were thinking that iTrader didn't have usergroup permissions.


And this changes because we don't use iTrader? This is a potential danger right now, with no type of rating system to speak of. Only now, the only way we'd know about it is if the affected user posts a thread about the person, and no one's checking threads for reputability. At least with rating system, any red flags can be chronicled and explained. A flawed early warning system is better then no early warning system at all.

Now, see, I have a problem understanding this one. How could you possible know that? I forget what they call that kind of argument, but your basically saying that they won't use a rating system based on how they don't use the non-existent system we have now. :confused:

As a member, every opinion counts. Yes, it is ultimately up to the administrators of the staff to make these types of decisions on what is implemented, the users provide the suggestions. Nex's opinion was that iTrader was not a good solution to that, and that is perfectly fine.

Also, please do not go around telling members that they have no say in anything.

iTrader has been discussed before. Its not going to be installed so there is nothing to be gained by people arguing or getting worked up about it. :)

I was just discussing it's merits, myself. For the record, I don't get worked up. Unless it involves Halle Berry, but that's not why you called...

I agree, every opinion counts. I have not said anyone doesn't have a say, so don't put words in my mouth. An infraction? Absolutely ridiculous, I've had enough of this. I assume Nex has received one too? :rolleyes: He's always rattling on how he's higher ranked than me. Likewise, I aren't the slightest bothered, I'll leave you lot in peace, but drop another note to Ashley.

Staff decisions / actions are not talked about in public. As Paul said there is no reason to debate, this thread is closed.