I don't think anybody expects to get rich off of add-ons. At least I don't. Minor plugins were always free from me, and are on XF too. It's the major add-ons that I charge for.

For someone to accuse a developer of being lazy when some add-ons have weeks, and in some cases months of time devoted to developing them, is just ludicrous.

Expecting all add-ons to be free (and supported) is even more ludicrous.

If vB allowed paid add-ons I would have converted precisely 2 of my add-ons to paid. All others would have remained free. But, I can not justify supporting add-ons for free. My time is worth something, even if it's pennies per hour. But a total income of $75 over 5 years doesn't even work out to pennies.

I never said devs were lazy, I said using the excuse that "vb.org doesn't allow paid addons" so "I'm not going to develop them anymore" is lazy..

I never expect someone to work for free but as I said, devs used to make and share mods for the better of the community. That isn't as widespread these days but I don't visit the vb support sites as much as I did at one time so maybe I'm overlooking a large group.

The next developer to come up with an essential plugin for vB5.x will be the first.

Don't get me wrong. There are some nice plugins but they are bells and whistles.

It's entirely possible to make one hell of a nice website with the core vB5 product.

We waited so long for vB5 to be similar to vB4 or vB3 in regards to having a decent plugin/hook system that imho it tanked vB5, lack-there-of in regards to previous customization capabilities compared to "can't do that on the cloud", "can't do that on vB5", "no decent plugin/hooks system exist" is what killed the community here and the developers soon followed so basically you waited too long and the girl you loved married the other guy! :p

I mean after all if the community can't depend on the developers who depend on vBulletin themselves to maintain a VIABLE product then what was there for us to do besides sit and twiddle our thumbs or help the community. Many of us do help, some more than others and some as often as possible but to have others assume that we should work for free and help for free is not right in the least, it is however their prerogative and right to assume and ours to simply know the reason why we do work for free or ask to be paid and simply keep on trucking.

Like I said above in the first part of my semi-rant (lol) "waited too long and the girl you loved married the other guy" is what vB5 sounds like in my head :p. I mean I could be proven wrong, there is still time to make it more VIABLE to countless customers but since it took this long just to have the system that allows you to make it "yours" by customizing to be re-introduced while still "lacking" as it is now does not speak highly to me that it will be anytime soon that we shall see a viable worth-while vB5 that's been customized in and out and looks sick as HELLO!

Exactly. They gave, gave and gave -- and didn't get back in proportion. This isn't sustainable and has resulted in so many things, mods taken down, mods taken off-site, etc.

You'll see this clearly with devs who have skin in the game, like @nhawk. Going back to what I said earlier, another symptom.

BINGO! What I was looking to say but you worded it perfectly. Definitely out of proportion!

Edit: vbr why you showing as unlicensed? I know you still own a license but PM me lemme know.

Not sure, but since I'm showing as unlicensed I can't PM :D

Edit: This can actually be a neat license validation method!
Edit 2: Paul said he'll look into it.

I remember when vb.org styles and mods was the best thing about vbulletin. The competitors didn't have much or it was mostly paid. I came over to vbulletin originally for the available mods which were 90% free as far as what I was looking for.

I don't see myself doing the same if I was brand new to running websites and wanting to start a fresh forum looking over vb.com and their pile of junk called vbulletin/5/forums/forums/community/index.php

so sloppy still and if you look at the architecture you'll quickly see why, who would want to build off that.. it's no wonder the plugin count is low.. hell, wasn't it locked down until recently when vb5 had plugin hooks added?

^ K so long as Paul already said he'd look into it, I just asked because I've never seen you show as unlicensed until today :p.

i agree it seems the priority list was all messed up for a while(like the 20 themes and hundreds of jira to fix them for example)

but vb5 i think is only just starting coming to its prime, or out of beta basically to be more accurate...and i still didnt see any needs to jump ship to another half measure i just want to see them prioritize basic functions more the next....2-3 versions even and perhaps that can be good enough...

5.2.1 seems to me like more of a major upgrade and less rushed than 5.2.0 and it maybe took forever to get here but its still going forward....maybe if ppl think like 5.2.1 = 5.0.0 it can make more sense :D

i mean...i think it should be clear that this was released GOLD early to trick customers to help them build it for free...if anyone remembers those first super raw versions lol u especially know what im talking about

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsT0Sod377I
heres some comic relief from 5 years ago, slamming xen for features they still didnt build aha but it is actually kinda funny to look back on.... i know alot of ppls frustrated but depending what you are trying to do and for me vb5 still has the most promise of future imho...we should get a free t-shirt by then tho....something:p