You don't get it. Other forms of archives is not acceptable by vb.org under these rules, only zip. Not even gzip, which vb.org uses by default to compress the bandwidht here.

You're some peice of work. Not sure how old you are, but thanks for the laugh. :)

If you are happy to accept everything you are told to do - without question - then fine, feel free to find another topic. I am not, and have no problem in making my points when I disagree with something.

Whatever. I think my teenage years are long passed. I'm simply not a doormat - if I dislike a decision then I will excercise my right to disagree. Unless, of course, another rule preventing this has been passed ..... :)

I mentioned windows because of your flase assumptions. OS'es ship with archiving tools, not ZIP. vb.org does not accept tgz or gz format.

Hmmm... Have worked on Unix/Linux based OSes for over 10 years and never had a problem with ZIP files. Always was able to uncompress without any external utilities or applications. This OSes include Solaris, HP/UX, and AIX among others.

Not making false assumptions, speaking on experience from almost 2 and a half decades of working with computers.

Your experience and environemnt don't match that of everyone, but since we both know this is not the reason, I'll stop discussing none Windows computers/environemnts.

You can't have it both ways. In one breath "it's not secrecy", and in another "bandwidth is just one consideration" and the admins clearly stated "cannot disclose the reason". And in one breath "Jelsoft has nothing to do with it" and in another "Jelsoft has to pay for the humongous bandwidth demand".

Let alone the fact vb.org has gzip compression enabled.

If you can't say the reason out loud, don't try to enterpret how companies allow or disallow internet access at work for employees, or how your Linux/Unix server is setup. The silliness of these excuses to avoid posting a single txt or xml files are more obvious than you think.

I have ZIP on my home PC and can manage, I just resent all these new secret policies and changes coming up lately.

I don't see why this is a big deal, Just zip the files. As members of vB.org we should all trust both Erwin and Xenon that any new policy that is put into place is for the better of the community.

Yeah, I wish those pesky dudes down at the United Nations would have done the same thing when Bush wanted to bomb Iraq to bits.

It would have been so much simpler if they would have just trusted America from the start.

:rolleyes:

Please don't tell me your comparing Xenon and Erwin to George Bush...please.

I truely respect your opinion.

The thing is, many of us where using vB since 1.x and were used to a certain level of honesty and transperancy. Recent decisions by the team raised a lot of alarm bells in many of us. We used to release code on vbulletin.com before vbulletin.org was created. There was mutual respect, and clear understanding why things were done. Recently this has changed. Part of it is the loss of transperancy, and things are chasnged suddenly and you have to live it, and announcements are made after the dead is done. That's bad, but livable. Then, the worst IMHO, is that some of the changes were to addres the possibility that you and me may release code to maliciously explot other members, which I find very offensive (it's another thread), and the possibility that you or me may priate copies (possibly this thread), and I also find that offensive.

As far as I'm concerned, ZIP is a trivial issue. The real issue is these excuses of "undisclose reasons", or the possibility of exploting or pirating. Granted, these thigns happen from a few members out of 10's or thousends, it's just wrong to make everyoen pay the price for such paranoia, and treat the whole community of developers in thsi way. So it's not the ZIP, it's a lot of little things here and there that signal bad things to come, which usually happens when you just accept such changes without even getting an honest answer for them. (bandwidth and employer work policies is not an honest reaosn IMHO)

Erwin already gave the answer, so please read his post.

Wayne already answered as well, so please read his post.

Hi tamarian,

As another long time (but in and out per work demands) member, I think it is safe to say that we both have seen changes -- to both sites.

I also think that it is fair to say that these changes have benefited the community in the long run thanks to Wayne's oversight.

While I appreciate your concerns about the recent decisions, I think that we need to let Erwin, Stefan, Brad, and their teams have some room to manuever here.

If they have a streamlined design that will make managing this place easier for the mods here (a key concept to ALL of us), that has at its core a one-file-per-hack limit, then what skin is it off any of our collective backs to abide by that?

I thought the members of one of the sites I run fighting over 'thread preview' was inane, but quite honestly, this argument ranks almost as high. :(

I will do this. I will offer to become the unofficial 'vb.org' zip queen. I will invite myself to a vb.org-specific gmail account and set up instant notification. Anyone who does not have access to a .zip compressor -- email me the files and I will zip them up and return them to you with a smile.

I am serious about that -- for anyone who would like the assistance. Just let me know. :)

If the problem was zip files, I'd say that solves the problem.

For those of uss who do not appreciate being considered pirates and malicious hackers/exploiters, it doesn't. :)

Hi tamarian,

Where was the indication that you [or any of us] were "pirates and [or] malicious hackers/exploiters"?

All I am seeing here is the admins trying to enforce a restriction to help moderate the forum.

I am not looking for a fight (not my style) -- it is just the admin in me that leans to defaulting to the mods here as I trust that they will do what is in the best interest of the community (and that trust based on the last few years of watching them in action)

Out of curiosity -- what would you suggest they do differently?

Damn, most of you act like old ladies! Me, as an end user, and *starter* coder love to have hacks zipped in just one file. Its tidy, simple, and you dont have to worry about how many files does that hack contain. Just one zip file, and no worries.

great rule, cya

You haven't been checkign the feedback forum lately :)

https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?t=91039
https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?t=91392

Plus the "cannot diclose the reason" why you have to zip even a single txt file in this thread, or bandiwdth reasons, or employer reasons... And a couple of other recent incidents.

That would have not been objectionable at all. Why would things that would "help moderate" the forum be such a top secret?

We're all admins here, and I assume we all want to build a better community. If you haven't noticed, most of the original vb.org mods, admins and founders are gone, and no longer here. That's not the issue. The issue is that changes should be for the best, and secrecy, hidden agnedas and excessive authoritative unjustifiable demands that don't make sense are not always for the best of any community.

About what?

Bandwidth is already compreseed on vb.org using gzip. There's nothing to do.

About transperancy and communication? As stated here and in other threads, transperancy, announcements prior to major changes, not after, and none, or less, of this "stop the discussion" "read the post" "we can't tell you why you must do this"... etc.

So are you saying that because we're not giving away all the reasons for the rule to the community that this rule is ineffective?

You don't even know what those reasons are, yet you come to the conclusion that they don't help the community at all, or to moderare it. You can judge that if you knew, otherwise you simply have no grounds to judge this rule on.

While I agree that zip is a trivial issue, this thread is titled "Hacks should be released in ONE ZIP file please" and so I was like okay, TPTB asked nicely so I will try to comply, but then I went to attach a puny text file in a post, and it was then that I noticed, that while the zip request is for hacks, it is now forced, even for posts. If you combine that type of action with posts like the one quoted herein, and with certain posts in the threads referenced above, it seems there is more of an us versus them mentality nowadays and certain posts only instigate further separation. Nothing personal to anyone, but it just doesn't feel as friendly and open around here anymore. Hopefully things will change for the better.

Well maybe something can be done so that the attachment restrictions only apply to the first post in hack threads, but you can image that might be a bit of work.

I'm really sorry that you feel like that. I hope it changes for you, too. :)

That seems to be the problem - no one except the chosen few knows, because you aren't saying. :)

Maybe it was already mentioned but perhaps there is a way to combine the files into a single zip upon upload?

I agree. Good post, Erwin.

Lively discussion here :)

When this was discussed internally, similiar arguments came up from staff. We discussed it and it was decided that we would restrict uploads to single zip files.
Allthough not everyone may agree, we still ask you to respect our decision.

On the other hand, because some voices have come up in this thread, I'm sure we'll have another look at the issue.
I could imagine that options like automatic zipping, allowing single files as txt/php and allowing different attachments in different forums are possibilities. Please don't expect changes before our upgrade to 3.5 though, as all of this would require code modification, and it was decided not to modify the code until 3.5 is available.

Thanks for your cooperation :)

Zip, schmip. :)

Sounds like a pretty good idea to me. If it has to be forced, that's not as cool, but if people are requiring force in order to do it, then it's acceptable.

Can anyone imagine the hassle involved in downloading a Style that was individual files? :)

The bandwidth reasoning is also a valid one for me...we are storing these hacks on vb.org's server, so teducing the load on that server is just common decency on our part.

But I have a better idea.
To conserve even more bandwidth, allow RAR archives. They take much less space than ZIP with the same contents.

If that was really common decency, then it will follow that members should not post anything unless it's related to a mod or a plugin. Since the average size of the plugin xml file is smaller than a many posts in the lounge forum, or image file formats which are still allowed. Maybe we can delete forums that are not related to hacks or styles like the lounge, to save some disk space and bandwidth...

It's not about bandwidth or disk space as many here seem to think. I'd gladly host vb.org out of my own pocket, but be sure that Jelsoft would not accept that, since this is beyond bandwidth, and for specific reasons.

Most OSes suppost ZIP but not all support RAR.

ZIP is the most prevalent archive utility out there.

I know. Unfortunately, that's true. Should be fixed by the OS developers though. -.-

I prefer tarballs. :devious:

Why? The only reason I can see is because it is a native Linux format. But, sizewise (if there is such a word) - isn't RAR still smaller?

rar has a better compression ratio but ace has the best. but neither are standardized to the point that zip is.

Yep, RAR is smaller, but I do prefer handling tarballs. (Yes, I use a Linux installation.) ;)

Luckily, Konqueror handles zip files well enough.

Just so members know, the vBulletin.org staff are discussing this issue as we speak to see if we can come up with a better solution. Thanks for your patience.

:up:

Why don't you develop your own way of compressing data? Call it .stefan or .erwin ;)

Satan

We are seriously looking into that. :)

For the record, no code changes are required, and it doesn't take that long to restore things as they were. File types are defined through the admincp in vBulletin. The same way the file types were removed instantly a week or two ago, they can be returned instantly as well, from the admincp.

If you want to stop modifying things until 3.5, then just stop modifying things until 3.5. Hopefully common sense will prevail by then.

We did it now so that when we go to 3.5 and use a new system, we don't have to go back and start zipping up attachments again.

I'm interested to know why you are so adamant against zipping up attachments - if only to save bandwidth and hard disk space for Jelsoft, it is reason enough.

Feel free to PM me to discuss.

For the same reasons I pointed out in the other 2 threads. The pattern now seems to go like this:

Staff decides to do something (usually disabling a stock vB feature, or removing a a hack), then they just do it. Then feedback comes in, then an announcement is posted after the fact saying things will be done this way from now on. If members don't like, 3 things will happen: One mod will say "read the post!", the other will say "We have reasons we cannot tell you" or "what do you really need that for?", and the third will say "We appreciate your opinion, and we may revisit the issue after we upgrade to 3.5"

As for saving Jelsoft bandwidth, despite it being already compressed with Gzip, let me say this: The disk space and bandwidth was initially paid by the founders of the forum, and there are many here who won't mind hosting it. Jelsoft picked it up in order ensure the licensing. Now that it has it and can check the licensing, now it complains about the monthly cost to run it? They can't have it both ways, either let soemoneelse run it and pay for it, or if they prefer to host it to ensure licensing, then they need to pay.

The more they increase control, and decide in the dark about all these issues, and we're just told to do it and "try to understand" without any obvious reason, the more it will driver down the quality of the work people are willing to share.

I know many members don't understand this, for they probably didn't see this pattern, and it only effects developers, but they might be next. They'll be equally outraged if they needed to fill things, or do certain things to download each hack, and being told they have to do it for "undiclosed reasons".

I'm sure you guys mean well, but your are overpolicing this thing to death, and making all authors pay for the sins of of one or two, which is not the right thing to do, period.

I said we were looking into other possibilities, for example zipping files when they're attached. These require code modification and for that reason we're waiting until 3.5.
Once again I ask you to respect this decision at least temporarily.