Hey K4GAP, check out some of my QSL cards on my site

Link?

IMO 4.2.x is a fine and stable product. (I run a few large ones and they are rock solid reliable) 5.x isn't ready for prime time yet, IMO, and is very slow. and 3.x has a VERY dated look, and is slowly being ignored by developers since it is being phased out/retired. Developers are probably focusing on 4.x, 5.x and other competing products.

There was no reason to give up, imo, nor is there a flaw/cause for blame in 4.x the product. (other than it being virtually ignored in favor of 5.x development) It sounds more like you had a problem with some very old custom mods in the 3.x environment, which needed to be replaced/updated in the newer 4.x environment. If so, that's a legitimate problem - but this thread was probably not deserved. (it implies that 4.x is broken somehow)

As far as I recall, all of the recent exploits were found in all supported versions of the product. (3 4 5)

Very good points and well presented.

Got it, nice.

You see - you already claimed that. I asked you to elaborate. Just repeating the claim and adding a non-statement like "it is what it is" makes me think you have no point to make at all there.

Given the database of vB3 and vB4 is pretty much identical apart from CMS and blog tables - no surprise there, really.

Starting to look like Facts are fiction. I still think vB4 Feels great :D

I guess the real issue is that some folks view vBulletin as an end product and get upset when it doesn't do exactly what they want it to do while others view vBulletin as a starting point and a good development tool.

It's like buying a new car and getting mad because the radio is not programmed for your favorite stations while others will read the manual and learn how to program it for themselves.

I purchased the full package including CMS and branding free option. I really didn't care for CMS so I only use it as a tool to create the CMS widget (the one on the left on my site - the right is a forum block widget). I then added some code for the fade out and collapse functions and a plugin to allow the CMS widget to be available on almost all the pages in my site. Now I have dual multifunctional collapsible widgets on most pages which is something vBulletin does not come with.

The point I'm trying to make is if you can code then change the package to do whatever you want it to do. If you can't code then accept it as it is or pay someone to change it. Complaining about it all day long will change nothing except your standing in these forums.

Except, they're not pretty much identical. v4 has many more tables and a much larger size of db, mainly due to all the "new" features in it that are actually ports of Mods and plugins that were made for v3. And it's clunky.

There's too many "Disco" people in here! Disco is dead, didn't you know?:D

And you seem to dismiss all the hard work you had to do to make your v4 perform almost as well as a v3 does. And seem to have forgotten what a terrible performer it was. The facts are the facts. v4 is bloated - vast difference between the file sizes of the packages after you download them from the members area and unzip them. v4 is almost twice the size of v3, and for no apparent reason. It's just reality.

OK, I think we've gone around in circles enough. To everyone who's posted, if you can't post without simply repeating what you've already said, then please don't post again. We could go back and forth forever with "yes it is, not it isn't", but it's not constructive. Getting the last word doesn't make you right.

Please show me where the forum itself has "many more tables". As I said: If we are fair, we're looking at forum only. There was no CMS in vB3, blog was an addon. We can count that in, but we will see that there has not been much change there, either. You would also have to show how a larger number of tables in a database per se is bad for performance, and how whatever difference there is between the empty database sizes affects performance.

You're still refusing to offer even the slightest hint of an argument. Or was that nonsense about the addons meant to be an argument? Then my question is: How, in your opinion, would an empty database table of such a feature hurt performance, if you don't use that functionality? Mind you, if you do use it, you'd have the same table in vB3.

Trying to get the "last word" is soooo childish ..... WORD :D

My money is on the mod who closes this thread will get the last word. :)

You win.