Well I know that but would be the same as me telling my kids they must thank me for every plate of food I sit in front of them... manners are manners but some things you come to expect and some you don't in the same respect you tend not to ask if it's already known... I know where your coming from on being appreciative though trust me.

Similar to a quote I like...
What I mean to convey w/ that is... sure not many will be appreciative but the few who are, truly are and usually make you smile :D. That's enough for me on a bad day :cool:.

I'm somewhere in the middle between Boofo and TheLastSuperMan on this one.

Sure, there are a few very appreciative folks who will go out of their way to show their appreciation (at times even support with a donation).

But, the vast majority do not thank or even acknowledge the hard work done by the coders in the community. They just come on, download and leave. Heck, some people don't take the time to even click install and rate the mod. Sheesh.

I know that I ALWAYS click install, rate the mod and thank the person/company providing the free service. I've also been known to send a donation to the coders as well. But, I'm also the person that will take the time to post a fix and help others if it's something that I know the answer to when the mod is unsupported or the coder is not available at the time.

So yes, it should not be expected that everyone will do these things...but, they should be appreciative and support the coders by words, donations or assistance. Then again, this is not a perfect world, right? ;)

Oh wow.. i rather pay 5$ to 10$ or maybe $50 for the .. mod instead of paying 50$ an hour for sombody to waiste there time eating hotpockets and fingure clicking and stalling a mod that takes them some 2 hours when it can be done in 5min..

Cause check this out.. you give out a free mod.. then it has bugs.. then u gotta pay people 50$ to fix them.. inall.. its not really free

ya feel?

--------------- Added [DATE]1308487869[/DATE] at [TIME]1308487869[/TIME] ---------------

Oh yea. btw.. i rate mods.. click install and appreciate the mods i like.. even vote for them for mod of the month... And im not complaing about 95% of the mod makers.. im talkin aobut the other 5% that make mods and leave bugs and never update there ish.. and then when they see people in the paid requests.. they pick them up to fix the mods for money.. so .. it aint FREE

ya feel?

--------------- Added [DATE]1308488093[/DATE] at [TIME]1308488093[/TIME] ---------------

Hey boofo.. if i thank you for your mods.. btw LMFAO.. your name kinda rymes with mo... nevermind..

anyways.. so if i thanked u for ur mods.. u gonna be happy???

Ill pay for ur mods.. if they were not free.. but i shure as heck am not gonna pay no 50$ an hour to install that ish

That's simple. Only hire coders that guarantee no bugs or full support. Or, read through the actual thread for the 'free' mods and decide whether you'd like to take the 'risk' of having to fix small (or large) bugs/issues.

Ultimately, it is your decision to either download and install or not. There should not be ONE complaint about anything other than a mod that says "supported" and the person/company is not providing support. Other than that, all we should read are questions and comments about how the mods/add-ons can be better or different based on the individual needs.

Then may I suggest that you learn how to code and debug your own mods. ;)

Ya feel?

This is going to make me sound evil and all, so I warn you that you coders/designers that don't get enuff luff will probably dislike me a lot after this... heh.

First of all, I -do- agree with what has been said, for the most part, about support here. It's not required to be given, and we should be grateful when it is given, both by coders and by regular Joes (so long as the regular Joes know wtf they're jabbering about, unlike me in a lot of cases). Because of the support given (not just to me, but to others that I've read), I've been able to learn more and more and more about vB and start doing stuff for myself, instead of having to rely on support 100% of the time.

With that said, I think that Coders and Designers should not expect donations or thanks or even "Mark as Installed." Yes, people should do those things! Don't get me wrong on that! But I think that, Coders who like to code stuff for other vB users and put it up for the community should do so because they like to do it, not because they're expecting something in return.

Please don't get me wrong! I'm not saying, in any way, that I don't appreciate the time and effort you Coders have put into the modifications I've installed. I really love that there's coders around here that would put that kind of time and effort into making something for the rest of us, with no guarantee of monetary support or even thanks. But that's just the thing--I don't think that coders should expect that monetary support or thanks. Heh.



Then, of course, there's people like the OP here, who seemingly don't appreciate the time and effort put into these kinds of things, or believe they're part of what he has paid for. More often than not, I would expect that they just don't realize that you guys do this stuff for free. It is their fault for being ignorant, yeah, but some of them learn, and I'd say that most of those who don't usually don't appear again, over and over, in the vB community, with their ignorance. I.E., they're NOT part of the "regular" community that really DOES appreciate your work.



I've downloaded and installed modifications from at least one of you (Boofo) that have posted here, maybe more (sorry guys, if I don't recognize your names), and I really am grateful. (Even so, it was only a few weeks ago that I actually went through all of my modifications to make sure everything was "Marked as Installed," and found at least four or five that were not. It's more my laziness at work there than disrespect to you guys.) I don't always show my appreciation, but it's ALWAYS a lot better than trying to code something myself that I have no experience in.




So, thanks guys. I don't always say it, I won't always say it, and I don't think I should always have to say it, but I am grateful. :P Those of us that are ignorant buttholes generally don't stick around, and I can't say much more than "bare with them." :< The majority of us do appreciate stuff.

Oh yeah, he should feel that alright :D

This is precisely the kind of attitude that causes coders to get fed up and leave.

Well, I guess there's a lot I just don't understand, then. I would think that expecting that and not getting it would make 'em leave, not the other way around.

Then again, I've not put a single modification up on vB.org, so that speaks for my [lack of] experience.

Lol what the heck is this Revenge of the nerds??
Borbolo giving boolo a high five??

All im saying is $50 an hour is too much... thats stage coach robbery...

Serious $50 an hour?? Your not doctors... whats u gonna php me back to health??

Oh yea and am i feelin that??
Man... even if u were a cute girl with her legs open nobody be feeling u!

Serioudly 50$ an hour?? Man nobody around here pays that much for a simple vbulletin mod coding... Not in cali where i live or in newyork... u must be in oklahoms or kansas or somthing
Some state where theres nothing to do. U understand how much california tax is?? Just because ur state doesnr charge that much dont think we got that extra cash to be paying u... i make like 11.88 an hour plus tips equals up to 23$ an hpur... so i shure as hell not gonna pay sombody more than what i make an hour for a just for fun coding mods... i mean if u were getting payed 50$ an houtw i dont see ur name on the forbes.. u aint no bill gates...

So why dont yall charge lower rates so u get more clientell.

I mean some of yall when i talk to u.. u be like.. i can provide support and let negotiate a fee and please email me ur requests.... pleasssee... this aint that important... negoyiate what??? 4$ a mod.. man u make m think im negotiateing some war documents with the president or somthing... u aint thay important fallback!!

I appologize for my misspelling as im typing this over my cellphone..

Anyway.. stop charging people rediculous prices..

And why dont yall code me a comback for that. PERIOD:cool:

It is that attitude that keeps coders from wanting to release anything, period (or answer your paid requests). I hate to break it to you, but there are coders who get upwards of $100 or more an hour, it is not unheard of. I have plenty of clients who regularly pay me $50-$60+ an hour.

If you want to get things done cheaper, go ahead, but for the most part you are left with lower quality products. I do not know how many projects I have taken on where the client originally paid someone $5 - $10 an hour for it, and ended up having to hire me to fix all of the code problems and their mistakes.

I hate that type of attitude. People who think they know how much a project should be worth or how easy it should be. How do you know? How can you tell me how much my time is worth?

We can charge whatever we want. Don't like it? Learn to code yourself.

Rahstyles2008, take a look at the forum Requests For Paid Services. Gander at the announcement, "Do Your Research Before Hiring!"

Note the third bulleted item on the list entitled "THINGS TO CONSIDER WHEN MAKING A REQUEST."

Yes, you are feeling that and very deep as you are a very cheap person who hires people to work in their forum and then don''t pay them as you think that every coder is here to serve your needs for free.


What a mod charges for his or her work is enterely up to him or her. If you don''t like a coder 's price then move on and find someone else who offers cheaper prices. No one is forcing you to except any price.

Do you remember last year when you first approached me to do some work at your forum? You asked me to do a forum upgrade and to upgrade 20 mods you had to vb 4x for 10 dollars in total. Because you did not have money and all that sobby lame excuses. And I still have all the emails we exchanged btw. What did I tell you? That for that price it was not worthy my time and good luck finding someone else to work on your forum. And that was it. I never pushed it that you except my prices. Look at your threads at the paid forum, why don''t you have many takers you think? But keep posting and posting for the same thing multiple times.

And I don''t care what the prices are where you live. I have my price for the work/service that I provide and if you don''t like them, then either start learn how to code or shut the hell up complaining and moaning like a baby and move on until you find someone whose prices are next to nothing.

No seriously... Code is a code.. theres no quality of a code .. .. seriously thats dumb dude..

I i write <img> and then sombody pays you 50$ to write <img> its the same thing..


And sombody paying sombody $100 an hour for installing a mod.. If thats true.. then u must be a millionaire..

All the coders i spoke to are usually not riding in rolls royces and there asking me why I drive a cadillac cts-v and they cant...

Seriously.. 100$ an hour.. shoot everybody shoulda been a coder then.. I wonder why people go to school years and years to become a docter.. and not even make 90$ an hour.. but then.. you coders are getting paid $100 an hour.. Hmmmmm :confused:

If you ask me.. I think its a buncha "Boofo" to me... LMFAO


Oh yea Eric.. i just looked at ur homepage portfolio.. you wrote:

I currently reside in the small town of Corbin, Kentucky – and I am currently unemployed

First off.. KENTUCKY LOLLLLLOLOLL ..

anways... why are u unemployed.. mr. 100$ an hour coder?? Hopefully its cause your super rich now.. making more money than a doctor.. that u dont need to be employed.. GOOD JOB eric

Ahahaha, at your previous post it was 50 dollars now it is 100 dollars, next you will say 1000 bucks.

You should really stop posting about things that you got no clue as you are making yourself look very stupid and rediculous.

Erics the one who said he makes 100$ an hour.. pimpin.. and i was commenting about him

maybe YOU should read other peoples posts to mine before you start commenting on my posts.. cause you got no clue why i said that and you are making yourself look very stupid and rediculous.. LOL

Exactly.. now code me back mr compu nerd

Simply no need, I had my mind set before reaching the end and now many others have enough info to sum you up.

Thank God for the ignore function here.

OK OK People let's move on, everyone including me :p.

First off, re-read my post. Where did I say I was getting paid $100 an hour? Let me quote it for you:

Most people know how to install mods, so most of my work is custom programming. Also, if you can't understand there is such a thing as quality code - there's no hope for you. I am unemployed yes, but how do you think I make a living? I freelance - of course I wouldn't mind a full time job, but I am doing well. I am also a full time student working toward a degree in IT and eventually Software Engineering - then I will be making even more. :)

So... is that all you can do? Comment about me being unemployed and where I live? You are not even making a good argument.

You strike me as quite an immature person given your tone and attitude. You are obviously making yourself look ridiculous, here is to hoping it does not take you long to figure that out.

--------------- Added [DATE]1308571304[/DATE] at [TIME]1308571304[/TIME] ---------------

I think that is a good idea. I have never had to use the ignore feature in vBulletin before, but it will come in handy. :)

ORLY? Code is code?

Do you like not being hacked because of exploits in code due to poor or lazy coding? Because maybe spending that extra $25 or $40 an hour upfront will prevent you from needing to hire someone to save your hacked site later on- not to mention a potential stolen database from which you can never really recover.

Coding is worth what someone is willing to pay- the free market system is in effect here. If a coder's prices are too high they will get little to no business. A coder that charges lower rates will often get more business. Assuming equal quality (which isn't usually true) it's up to the coder to find a "sweet spot" on the supply/demand graph. They can charge $100 and get one coding job per week or they can charge $1 and get 100 coding jobs a week- in the end they both make the same money but the guy who charges $100 still comes up ahead because he only used a fraction of the time the other guy did.

Another reality- Coding/programming and other technical things are SKILLED LABOR. Your waiter job or whatever else that is paying you "tips" is NOT skilled labor. Now yes, I know some waiters who are great at their job and I could never do it as good as they do but the fact is they are only bringing food to the table- anyone could do it. Not anyone can code. If you don't like the prices people are charging, then learn coding. If it's that easy start releasing your own mods and build up your own client base offering a flat $4 fee.

I suggest some members take a chill pill, trolling, baiting and insulting are not permitted.

"Coding is worth what someone is willing to pay- the free market system is in effect here. If a coder's prices are too high they will get little to no business. A coder that charges lower rates will often get more business."


^^ thank you.. thats all i wanted to hear... that means u agree with me..

And im not a server.. Im a slot technician.. and yes that does take skills to do.. its not somthing everyone and there dads can do right off the bat.. YOu have to learn it and we take tests every week..

Just like coding u.. gotta learn it..

But i for one am not getting paid 50$ an hour.. or even close to that.. which I doubt Sombody installing mods getting paid $50 an hour is rediculous.. I hope some people can agree with me on that..


BTW ignoring people show ur weak and plus its easy to gang up on sombody in a thread. Funny i bet non of you people in here can argue with me one on one. Only reason you even spoke ur mind to me is because u read this thread and u had back up of sombody already attacking me. You aint no mature person your all (for those who attacked me) are as immature as me.. but with no comback..

I mean you got to admit.. some of those lines i spoke off where pretty funny...

I know this because i used to freestyle battle people at lunch back in highschool.. I got some pretty good punchlines.. I know this because people.. repeated my line and said that was dope after the battles ;)

code is code and there's no quality of code, lol, it seems like you don't know anything about what's going on here.

an example for you:

a template made with dreamweaver, drag and drop. used a lot of tables.
a template made by hand-coded, css and xhtml valid. tabless.

both template looks the same, and what's the different then, answer yourself!

a mod for display statistic of your forum that require a lot of querry, slow down your server.
a mod for display statistic of your forum that require less querry, fast, ajax powered.

what's the different?

Apple can keep the price lower for Iphone and Ipad so it can bring them much more customers but the truth that their prices always at top of the market. Please explain me why they should do it?

The answer that it's not only about the quality of works but also the brand of the product.

Note that we have proof that all materials requires to made a complete apple product is xx times cheaper than the price of the product itself.

People do make $50 or even $100 per hour for coding, but probably not for vb mods (or at least not many).

Maybe you misheard them.

If I buy you some knickers will you send me to your list? :D

--------------- Added [DATE]1308605813[/DATE] at [TIME]1308605813[/TIME] ---------------

Wow I've just read through the rest of this thread ++++ me, what is going on here.

The support @ vbulletin.org is second to none
The coders @ vbulletin.org deserve recognition
There is an overwhelming silent majority that are very greatful for all of the above.

Boofo is being made a scapegoat in this thread and it's really not on.

Dude seriously??? i aint even gonna read your post after your first sentence.. come get at me.. when u said somthing sombody hasnt already said in this thread..

--------------- Added [DATE]1308608906[/DATE] at [TIME]1308608906[/TIME] ---------------

Na i heard them correctly.... You werent even there so.. you wouldn't know ..

NEXT...:cool:

Didn't have to be there, I just had to read your earlier posts.

Here's the short:

1) Everything costs.
2) Some have money, some don't.
3) Some spend money, some don't.
4) Some pay more than others, smart shopping or being business savvy it's whatever you want to call it.
5) If you want it done right do it yourself, if can't do it yourself, use your best judgment and hire someone who you feel will do a good job within your budget.
6) ^ Walk away happy either way, the works done and you have something to admire whatever it was, job well done by whoever.

And that's pretty much it, what more is there?

This thread has already given a few the wrong impression of others and I won't stand for that so let's quit the bickering and banter, back to our forums I say!

Interesting thread. Here are some of my thoughts.

I've recently put up a few mods that I thought might of generic use.

Our site has some paid for mods (VaultWiki, Photopost Gallery, vBA CMPS, and some skins);
plus a few vb.org mods (that are all marked installed, for which we are grateful);
plus some home grown mods, some of which are very specific and won't be released,
and some I have released.

I'm not that interested in $$ for what we have released.
I would want $$ for the photographic competition system IF the end user used it on a paid forum.
This however it is a niche market product. (~12,000 lines of code)

BTW our site is free, and we give out ~$5,000 in prizes each year via sponsors and revenue
from our shop and advertising - not bad for free membership :up:

Also: $50 an hour for a experienced developer is good value :D
My day job is an IT Project Manager/Systems Architect for a large rail infrastructure company.

The real issue is people expecting pro level support for voluntary work
all I can say to the complainers is grow up!!
Treat the free/voluntary developers and their mods with the respect they deserve!

Actually do the same for the paid mods!
Why? Because you will get better support by being nice than banging you hands on the table.
Work with the support people if you have an issue - provide concise relevant information
when you have a problem or feature request.
Politeness goes a looooooong way!
Same goes with dealing with IB/vB.com

If it's a paid mod, then sure I expect it to be supported and I find that to be the case and I can
express my needs and I get listened to - by being polite and helpful.

So in summary, be polite, work with developers, and be grateful. It makes everyone's life better.

Kym

If you not compuNerd enough to... un..de..errs..tand my.. punc..hl..i..nes..... then thats cool.. I appreciate it.. but .... get off my jock... NO ****... :down:

--------------- Added 21 Jun 2011 at 12:37 am ---------------

Yea i understand you.. but what if polite doesnt work? If your too polite to sombody then people will think your a pushover.. Man.. I guess.. its just areas where i grew up... people dont take shyt from nobody around here.. and if u show your weakness.. then thats when your gonna get taken advantage.. off.. people around here know that ..you get respect then u give respect... Seriously.. I wish i grew up in your beverly hills neighbor hood..were everybody is nice.. and is a pushover..around here in socal highschools.. we got a New York State of Mind.. we dont take ish from nobody... not even the principle.. Well smack that niccorette if we have too..

sorry but this line made me think of CFH :p

Its all good my niclet

I grew up in Canarsie, Brooklyn. You have to have learned at some point the rules on the 'street' do not apply to the rest of the real world. It is much more treat others as you want to be treated than dog-eat-dog, especially on a site like this.

Word. Respects to you my NY fam

What is a "niclet"?

I think Eric is dead on. If you don't value their work, then you don't know value when you see it. You're likely paying for absolute shit, that opens doors for hackers and other problems.

Just because something works, does not mean it works well. Is it portable? Does it still work when you upgrade (vBulletin, php, mysql, etc.) Does it scale to hundreds of users? thousands? millions?

Consider this - programming literally takes years to get good at. Some people spend decades doing it. Programming is one of the rare professions where if you are good at it, you can do things much faster than those who aren't. Sometimes it's 2-3x faster, sometimes it's 20-30x faster. Sometimes it is 1000x faster.

You may pay someone $10/hr for a month, when it might take me 2 hours at my ridiculously high rate (not really). Would you pay my rate up front? Probably not. It probably will be cheaper though, not even taking into account maintenance, bugs, etc.

There is so much that you do not understand unless you are a programmer, or work with programmers often. You're going in blind.

I guess arrogance is bliss.

Dude momatter who does the work.. its gonna have problems.. but thats not the intall problem.. its the mod problem

--------------- Added [DATE]1308700024[/DATE] at [TIME]1308700024[/TIME] ---------------

Dont play son... YOu know what that means

The better the programmer, the less problems.

(I heard of a programmer who released software with no bugs, though it's just a legend) ;)

First, I've got socks older than you, so please refrain from calling me "son". Second, if I knew what it meant, I wouldn't have asked, now would I?