19-19 keep it comming... back to back

Maybe this is so, but he's also finishing a war that Clinton should have finished.

If you mean by not controlling our border... If you mean the endless spending on pork vote buying projects by politicians... If you mean a bit of a botched war in Iraq... If you mean the violation of our rights... then yes you are correct. But, those that say he's responsible for gas prices, pollution, global warming, and such are just not that smart.

You think Bush had anything to do with any of which I just mentioned? lol... right. Bush is nothing but a puppet, a figurehead if you will just like every other president before him for the last 100+ years.

Nope, this war doesn't make any sense. But, then again neither does nuclear bombs, biological weapons, and genocide.

Bush? What about Kerry? Edwards? They voted for the Iraq war. Lots of people were mislead. Doesn't mean it wasn't the right thing to do, I just think we should have gone about it a different way.

I'm neither for or against Bush. I did not vote for him, nor did I vote for Kerry. I voted for the Libertarian Candidate.

Its easy to criticizing.

I think Bush does the best he can to protect our country. Hes a good president. Everyone can hate him, but American MUST ( yes, MUST) love him. I don't think anyone can do as good as him.

Not so, this is the great thing about our system of government....the people can get rid of the leader if enough of us find we aren't pleased with him and the things he's doing.

Do I think we should kick him out? Nah, that would probably cause more problems then we have now. Lets face it he has about two more years left before he's gone for good and knowing our legal system by the time we got him out we'd be gearing up to vote for the next guy.

Do you want to know the real problem? Well even if you don't I'm going to tell you...so listen good;

The problem with our country is this; People stopped caring about it loooong ago. Honestly who wakes up in the morning and thinks "Boy that war in Iraq is a +++++, what can I do to help bring that to an end?" "Man our public schools are really starting to get bad, what can I do to help fix that?" "I hear 'x' country is not pleased about something our government did, what can I do to help them see that not all of us are such ass holes?"

There is your problem right there, you're so busy making a living for yourself and taking care of your own business that you can not find the time (or don't care to find the time) to do something about the problems in the USA.

You know what we outa do? Get rid of the 'two party' system. Let anyone in this country run for any position of power without the need to pay each state/county to get their name on the ballot. Give anyone willing to run TV and radio time for free and make sure they get just as much as anyone else does. Throw people in jail that accept kick backs from certain companies in exchange for helping pass laws that allow them to do anything immoral (the insurance ring is a very good example of that). These three things will prevent the rich from running the show, in other words it gives the common man like you and me a chance to hold a position of power within the government.

The people also need to realize that it's time to stand up and let them know that we're sick of their bullshit! This needs to be done on the local, state, and federal levels. Damnit lets solve some real problems instead of bickering over the same crap year in and year out. Who cares about gun control? Does making firearms illegal solve anything when I can buy a hot handgun on any corner for less than $100? Who cares about sex in the media when I can buy a playboy at any local gas station? Who cares about violent video games when people are getting shot in the streets? Who cares if a women does not want to give birth to a child at this time, that's her choice not mine, not yours.

All I want is this; A government that up holds the values that this country was created for. A government that minds it's own damn business because what I do in my private life is no one's business but my own. A government that doesn't send it's sons to die in a useless war in a country that has nothing to do with 9/11.

The main issue with Iraq is this; Even if they had 'weapons of mass destruction' that is still no reason to start a war. Honestly what world power has the most fire power right now? We do. What world power has the most advanced military? We do. Knowing that why isn't the rest of the free world sending troops over here because we have 'weapons of mass destruction'? I'll tell you why; because they know better. It doesn't matter how much man power or fire power some country has because they have a right to arm and defend themselves just like we do. They aren't going to declare war on us until we attack them. Remember this, the guy that fires the first shot is likely the 'bad guy'.

Think about it this way; how long did the cold war last? How much fire power do you think the Soviet Union had? How much of that firepower was locked, loaded, and ready to go in the event that war broke out? How much did we have pointed at them? Now...how many people died as a cause of that 'cold war'? Probably not anywhere near the number of deaths that were a result of every minor (non-world war) we've been a part of in the last 100 years or so.

What we need is another Soviet Union, a country that does not see eye to eye with us but has enough firepower to keep us from even thinking about starting a war with them. I belive China will take over that role at some point in the next 20 years and we'll be stuck in another long term cold war. I just hope it doesn't turn 'hot' or we'll be in a world of trouble. Maybe going back to the old way of living will be better though. At least it would weed out the weak people that have no idea how to live off the land and survive without the grocery store and the power grid. Sure we won't be able to sit on our asses anymore but is that such a bad thing?

Brad just won this thread, and I agree pretty much with everything he said.

[high]* Shazz waits for something better[/high]

Do you like Bush? -- Not really, he comes across as too hard headed at a time when compromise is greatly in need. He also seems to have an inability to swallow his pride which is a very important quality in a leader.

The way I see it though, it's impossible to form an opinion on his presidency at this point in time. At least an intelligent one anyway. Granted the tea leaves have not been in his favor these past few years but history will be the true test of his "legacy". I'd feel alot more comfortable making a judgment on his administration's policy twenty years from now.

TBH what I really loathe is the media. In my opinion the worst thing that has happened to the US is this partisan, draw a line in the sand, kindergarten behavior that our media so readily facilitates. We need to work together for the greater good not bicker amongst ourselves.

Divided we will fall. It's as simple as that.

Awe yea right come on.. Best he can at what, lies and loosing respect from not only democrats but from republicans also. I know many republicans that wished they never voted for Bush...

Thank you da420, I would reply EXACTLY the same way you did. I don't have to do it now. LOL

I LMAO @ kerry/edwards stickers I STILL see on cars even today. wtf

Brad, I agree with most of your points Brad, with the exception of a few which I will point out and express my opinion.

I agree with everything in that paragraph with the exception of giving free airtime. I think they should still pay as it is using up the private sectors air time, and the government should have no control over the private sector.
If a private organization wants to give free air time, then so be it.

Another thing is get the people that are passing laws out of there that are doing immoral things is to elect those that are not as such, and if we disagree with something they do people need to be contacting their senators and representatives to get this stopped. Will it happen? Well, when the politicians start losing their jobs because they are being voted out it sure will.

You made a point of Iraq not being a threat... quite honestly, any religious dictator with nuclear and biological weapons and has been known to dabble in a bit of genocide is a bad thing in my book, and the world will be a better place when he finally is ridden of this world and sleeping with the worms.

Other than that, very well said in my honest opinion. There are a few other points I could get into, but they are a bit controversial, and I'm not sure of the rules here at vB.org about political threads.

Yes, the media is bad. But, greater good sounds too much like socialism, and *gasp* communism. We need to go back when we actually had some individuality, where we can be free to do as we please as long as we are not harming those around us. That is liberty.

So, who would they have voted in? Kerry? Thank (insert religious idol here, and if you are an atheist insert the word 'rock') they voted for who they did. Although, mind you, I did not vote for Bush. The candidate I voted for got less than 400,000 votes.

Apologies on not being more specific. I am in no way an advocate of socialism or communism. My point is that while we spend time fighting amongst ourselves people are dying for little more then pride.

The greater good for all people should be worked towards however. If you want to put a label like socialism on it then so be it. I prefer calling it compassion for your fellow man.

-------

I also highly agree with Brad and it very well could be successful but the fact remains that the rich have always ruled and in all probability will continue to do so.

Personally I feel this country needs major changes as im sure many would agree. But sadly these changes are unlikely to ever come about.

Stop complaning!

US is way better to live than EU.

Gas price too high? nah, i don't think so, In EU it even higher. People over there they wish to have our price.
Bad Economy? not at all. just too many lazy people who don't want to go to work.

We are just too lazy and we expect our president does everything for you? I don't think so.

only time will tell. in my opinion, Bush does the best he can, And he's a great president.

Please qualify exactly WHAT it is that makes him a 'great president' in your opinion. I can't grasp it from your comments.

Well, when you guys said Bush was bad or good, which is relative to whom ???