TheLastSuperman... for me its about pedigree. When Kier Darby and Mike Sullivan were running the show, I was a lot happier than I am now. Since IB took over, for me it has been nothing more than complaint after complaint; with me even outright calling the IB team retards at vbulletin.com. While yes, I haven't seen ANY code for XF, the programmers over there have built a level of respect and trust that I just haven't seen with VB4.

Yes, it may be eye-candy, but honestly I think thats the way to go. If you look at VB4, and then look at XF, you can see a fundamental difference in design. VB4 was mostly about making things easier for the administrator (which it has completely failed at), while XF seems a lot more about making things easier for the USER. Users are the lifeblood of any forum community; and VB4 hasn't really helped in that regard.

If you want to relate this to the Titanic at all... then VB is the Titanic, not XF. You may view us as RATS deserting a sinking ship; but you can't ignore the fact that the ship in SINKING. And switching to XF as soon as I can, does not mean on launch; I will wait it out until they have a good CMS coming along... something that VB4 STILL doesn't have. The XF team have already stated that they want to make sure the forums work first, before they start expanding.

Hmm...

You have some good statements there I can't argue with tbo and I'm not afraid to admit that :o. I might come across harsh when seeing xf xf xf but it's only because I don't feel that people can make a well informed decision at this point without seeing it run on a larger scale, live sites and hearing their feedback and seeing the initial bugs. I also believe that no one is admitting to the fact that much of the hatred and I specifically mean aside from the bugs comes solely from the change in the new license agreement - I truly believe that is making this crock pot simmer a bit too much and it's clouding everyone's judgment. Just please make a well informed decision, I only get riled up because we're hyping up something nothing more. I have respect for the developers of each but not when it comes to thread hijacking in mass proportions. I believe everyone has a right to feel in their own way.

It's just too early to be making such statements and half of the time it's accompanied by a unique complaint or s simple "bugs" or if they fix this I will be staying etc we all just need to wait and be patient, make a well informed decision even by positng this we all could have been posting suggestions, me for vB you for xF but instead we all squabble?

I was actually just told off by my wife for wasting time typing this, she means in general not a waste towards you so I'm getting off for a few minutes, I admit to being whipped too but people just be patient and if xf is that good, it will be better than Christmas otherwise you'll end up with coal so be happy with what "you've got" now as our parents always said.

Actually, most of my complaints about VB4 (and VB3.8) do not come from bugs, but from core design... hell, I don't even know what the license agreement changes were; I don't care. VB4 should have made things easier and given us more features; and it didn't do any of that. Most of my complaints stem from the poor implementation of the stylevar system; which took a working "universal" system in VB3, and made it less universal, while at the same time claiming that the new stylevar system would make things EASIER for the administrator... when it didn't.

And its not just VB4, even VB3.8 introduced some "odd" design. Looking at the Album Art system; which doesn't make any sense at all; there is no built in album art library where users can browse all uploaded art. The system only lists recently updated albums; and your own... and even then, it doesn't sort the dates by images, but by update codes for albums. Then look at the Social Group system that didn't make any sense either. The whole idea of a "social group category cloud" violates the entire notion of "discovery" by promoting the large groups while playing the newer groups on the wayside.

The more I use VB4 the more I wonder if "Internet Brands" has any idea how people use the internet. Double click to get to the advanced post reply? Thats not how the internet works, and that will never be how the internet works. Why do the forum sidebar and the CMS sidebar use diffirent widgets? For that matter, why is there no widget XML exporter and importer? A lot that comes from IB just doesn't make any logical sense... like why is XFBML disabled?!

How did you do that image right thing?

I want to have my object previews (videos) centered, any idea how to do that?

I see your point now, of course VB is the only thing out there!

its all good, but staying informed :>

Just thought I would update that everything is still going very nicely at www.TabletPCBuzz.com. I am having the nice folks at urljet.com who have been doing a very good job with hosting and updating us take the site to 4.1.3 this weekend. Hopefully it will go as smoothly as all the other upgrades.

I am looking forward to the mobile and other updates that are coming soon.

John