Some do. ;)

I would like to see some of those changes too, Paul; some others too.

Yes, unfortunaetly, some do :D

I'm sure a couple of you all new my post was comming as i too have posted a thread like this that got similar posts ;)... By the way, i leave for about a week or so and you guys start this without me!? Hehe. Anyways, here's my $0.02:

The History?
When i first joined vb back in the 2.3.x days it was all about firefly, chen, etc. From the simple quick reply hack that became beyond popular and already implemented to Lesane's store hack who's concept still holds today, it is obvious that coders have built the foundation and dare i say "backbone" for the vbulletin.org in which we know today.

[HIGH]The Present
[/HIGH]It has become nothing short than obvious that personal vendettas have led to community disputes for a long time now. Like many people here mention, us coders are part of the reason in which users come to vbulletin and the only reason a user would even think about comming to vbulletin.org Also, as someone mentioned, without coders, there would be no vbulletin.org to hold modifications made by us. Without the extra modifications made by us, the expansion and a lot of the already implemented add ons in which our coding has resulted in would not exist. That being non existant means vbulletin being nothing more than an ipb or phpbb or even an ezboard.

The Present Issues
It is obvious that us coders seek just a little bit more in return. If not for the money in which we have made for vbulletin or the optomization in which we have made possible for users to have, then atleast for the time and dedication put into each bit of coding.

[HIGH]Zach[/HIGH] - I believe that you made the statement about coders not making up the community and the users being the blood of this forum. Answer me this question, without us coders, why would users come here? You also made the point of people comming and leaving being a cycle, in regards to that, ask yourself how much faster this cycle has been going as vbulletin.org has gotten older. Need i say more?

[HIGH]Tony[/HIGH] - I agree with you as far as you not showing lack of professionalism by being blunt and atleast attending to issues regardless of the cause or solution (if any). However, at times your ability to be so blunt and at times possibly ignorant has led to a bit of dispute.

My Suggestions
Ask not what your coders can do for you, but what you can do for your coders?

• A hack database - Hopefully all of this anticipation will lead to an actual result. This will allow for a more organized modification thread and way of handling bugs and such, which then will lead to less complaints of users not being attended to.
• A place for commercial scripts to be posted - We help you, why not help us? We are allowed to post the light versions, is having an area to promote or premium version so bad?
• More input and idea spread amongst from all usergroups - It's always coders vs staff vs members i've noticed. If everyone would input and put yourself in eachother's shoes, a relation can lead to a resolution.
• Coder of the month - It's nice to show what hack has been most useful, but why not make it more personal?
• Vbulletin Coder Teams - Lets learn to work with eachother more. Why not form our own development teams and such and have competitions? Perhaps a purpose for a modification can be set and the team who codes and designs it best wins and stuff. Competition creates more work and fun as well as more communication.
• Keep Personal Issues Personal - Pretty Self Expanitory.

The Vbulletin Meeting/Chat
Let it be known that i too (right with Revan), will be going to war if i am not part of this chat :p. Hopefully my years of experience with vbulletin as both a rookie user to a rather experienced coder will help as far as what i can input and bring to the dialogue. Just send me a pm here or email to gio@dopegfx.com :p

I want all the coders here to do this:

Open up a corner grocery store and demand that your customers respect and honor you because withjout you, they would have to walk further to get their groceries, and then send me your sales totals for the first week.

Um... what?

How long would you be in business if you craped on all your suppliers?


Get real

No one is asking for honor boofo. Apparently you are getting the impression that some people are looking for sympathy and appraisal. I frown upon sympathy and those who feed off it. However, i also frown upon those who fail to realize that there very purpose for being where they are now is credited to those who they fail to appreciate.

I want you to do this:
Ask all the coders to leave vbulletin.org and come back and see what purpose you have here as a moderator.

Without customers, there would be no need for coders. Appreciation should come from within for a job well done, not from someone on the outside. ;)

Just kidding Boofo. :) Anyway, I'm done with these lame arguments. Good luck to world peace.

I'm not talking about suppliers as you are not talking about Jelsoft, and THAT is real. Attitude is more important than any code you will ever write, my friend.