So if what you are saying is True then surely should be a sticky to the effect stating that Once you part with funds the coder is under no obligiation to do any paid work for you and that should they decide not to please do not post on the forum as we simply dont want to know.

Why wont vb.org give us their view on this whole situation as this post aint gone un-noticed.I also agree that it works both ways - the coder gets ripped off by the payer so you telling me no hackers on vb.org could`nt come up with a decent in-house hack where valid feedback could be left so everyone would know in a instance who was worth hiring based on past feedback and who are worth steering clear off.

Come on vb.org - we love the board,so give us something we want plz.

OK- so this guy still hasn't gotten any of his money back? Interesting. I have a few thoughts on this matter:

( I apologize if any of this has been previously posted)

One should not hold vbulletin.org in any way responsible for losses or damages. They simply offer a place for a collection (a nice collection, BTW) of hacks we ALL use on our sites. I, for one, am very grateful for such a place.

A prospective client should do some sort of research on the coder(s). Perhaps, there could be some sort of feedback hack for this place, like on ebay? You know, like "X has 941 positive comments of 943 jobs" or something. That would aide the client in this research, and possibly save VB.org some headache.

Removed as it is against site rules

Just some food for thought. Carry on!

I'm not saying you didn't follow through, I don't really know all the details. I am just talking about the general attitude of "I have problems, so that justifies not delivering what was promised". You and some of the other coders mentioned here are making it sound like that is how you feel about it and that it justifies things.

Everyone has problems. But as a person offering products/services for money, it is YOUR responsibility not to allow YOUR problems to effect YOUR customers. It isn't your customer's job to deal with not receiving something you took the payment for because of your problems. At the very least, if you can't deliver something due to other issues, explain it to the buyer and return the money. They will probably understand.

And I'm talking solely about whatever was promised on the front end, not 24/7 support and all of that (unless of course you promised that as part of the sale). Sure, some buyers have unreasonable expectations that you don't have to meet. But he should be able to expect a product that works as it was advertised, delivered in a timely manner. If he paid for installation services offered by you, he should expect to receive them. If all that was done, then the guy really has no complaints. Quality of scripts (spelling errors, etc.) are a whole seperate issue.

Even if you don't do this for a living, you have entered into a business transaction once you start selling a product. The customer has every right to expect you to deliver what you have accepted payment for. It's just common sense. When you pay for a package at amazon.com and they never send it, would you accept it if the salesperson told you "Well, I've had some problems at home, I'll try to send it soon if I can?" Of course not. You want your package or your money back.

I'm not trying to go off on you personally, its just that I have seen a lot of this type of attitude from coders who promise things, take the money, and then don't deliver as if their own problems justify not doing the job. Its really a detriment to the many coders out there who do what they say they are going to do.

As long as threads like this one are allowed, it is a good counterbalance. As the "home" of the VB community, we need to be able to discuss good vendors and bad vendors.

It would be very difficult for vb.org to try to police this, as there are always 2 sides to every story and they probably don't have the time to play "internet cop" or arbitrator between 2 third parties.

Yeah, I guess so. Just be aware though if a person comes here slagging a coder off without some hard evidence to back his case up. There is such a thing as "slander" though if he feels your bad mouthing without any evidence to back it up is hurting his business.

There is also always the possibility that another coder might be jealous of a main competitor, and could create an account here to bad mouth him, so he loses respect and work to the other side. Seeing as any member can post on this particular forum board.

Summed up nicely.

True..... When they're in shape...... :D

Don't piss yer Gramps off! lol :)

you know what they say, big things come in small packages. :)

shouldn't even have to come to an asswhoopin.........the guy should just be a man and pay the person back......that would be the biggest thing he could do......but know, he prefer's to hide like a coward.

First Gio and now Tim. Tisk Tisk...

I'm surprised .org doesn't do anything about these situations. It's not fair to the clients and the legitimate freelancers out there like myself. Situations like this will just continue to hurt the market.

I don't see why it would be such a big deal to prevent access to this forum if there name is blacklisted. It's pure laziness that no one does anything about this, and coders will continue to get away with peoples hard earn money.

hey thanks for the offer m8 :)
dunno, i think had you posted that 4 months back, and if i had his address, i would probably have gone along. (lol i was that annoyed, more because he was coming with lame excuses all the time. there is one thing not paying, there is another coming with excuses saying you are the good guy and trying.) Its pretty clear he was doing nothing of the sort. Since the time this thing is going on, he has found time to release hacks, approach other people for work and get paid for that(all the while telling me that he is not getting paid, and i have put that in 1st page, while if he wanted he could have easily paid me back, and even to the extent that he found time to release hacks, ask donations and still tell me that he was having trouble with FBI and all.

And some asked why open threads, because there are some things you cannot know if i hadn't posted this, and i am thankful to vb.org for allowing it. Only after the thread did i find that others had paid him, that he approached other people for work, who most importantly, paid him(he told me all his clients are unreliable and don't pay) and that hecan be active as and when he chooses to, like he comes here when his account gets blocked(sorry i had to post this.. there was a reason why the thing with andem got settled, and unfortunately in my case it can't be settled that way cos my transaction was with paypal)

Its the sheer depravity of this guy that beats me. He couldn't have found a guy more willing to give him time if he wanted. People get busy, all do, i do in my work and things go offtrack, if you spent the money, well earn it and pay. And when you have the capacity to do that and when you are doing that, why you won't wanna do that?? You are an old member around here and my hope even while making the thread was that he would see this, feel a bit bad and pay. And if he paid, i had no intention to even keep the thread here. He has all this on record btw on his msn(and i have it too.. lol)

nothing to say more, than wait. Some day he will see reason.