[ANSWERED] style contest?

[drives fast]

now why would you hav e a style contest forum that we can't access?
I see there are two threads in there...what good is it if it says "no peeking"?

[Erwin]

You can only see the contents of your own threads. The forum is there for members to upload styles to us, not let other members see it. :)

[filburt1]

But we can see threads >:) :D

It's designed so that you can't be "inspired" from other submissions, among other reasons.

[Xenon]

Haven't you read my announcementthread?

i think i clearly stated that the forum is just for submitting styles, not for peeking styles

[nuno]

Today at 04:05 PM Xenon said this in Post #4 (https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?postid=412322#post412322)
Haven't you read my announcementthread?

i think i clearly stated that the forum is just for submitting styles, not for peeking styles

And you call that Competition? :huh:

[Rose]

We use similiar methods for contests at one of the boards I work at. It works great! I hope vB.org gets lots of entries. :D

[Xenon]

@nuno: You never have Played cards, poker for example, did you?
Since when do you need to know what cards the other player has before you play with him???

You'll see the winning cards after the contest.

Also it's for copyright questions, as everyone would be able to download those files...

[nuno]

That's a rather strange analogy...

[Xenon]

It was just an example.

there are a lot of competitions where you don't see what the others do...

[drives fast]

The Best Style will get a vB License courtesy of Jelsoft
You must have a valid vBulletin license
seems kinda odd...no? Why do you need to win a license if you have to already have one just to participate?

Even we can decide not to use every of your modified template
that is not much of a contest.....I say if you choose a winner you should use the style as is or do not choose it as the winner.
Also it's for copyright questions, as everyone would be able to download those files
what copyright? Just because somebody makes something doesn't make it copyrighted.....you have to actually copyright it.

The way I see it....this is a joke. You want others to submit lots of styles and you are going to pick at them like a chicken wing and use what you want. Why not make your own style? The prizes are lacking incintive.

I would like to see styles that paople make because I lack the imagination to create one from scratch myself but seeing others makes my ideas start working.

Good luck with your "contest". You should make out real well as a result of it.

[Chris M]

Yesterday at 12:55 PM Xenon said this in Post #7 (https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?postid=412544#post412544)
@nuno: You never have Played cards, poker for example, did you?
Since when do you need to know what cards the other player has before you play with him???

You'll see the winning cards after the contest.

Also it's for copyright questions, as everyone would be able to download those files...

I know all the cards in the pack;) And I know that the cards I have my opponent wont;):p

@drives fast -
seems kinda odd...no? Why do you need to win a license if you have to already have one just to participate?
Your licence might expire, you may want to start another forum etc...
that is not much of a contest.....I say if you choose a winner you should use the style as is or do not choose it as the winner.
Once they choose it, it becomes the property of vB.org - They can do what they want with it - And I assume most of what they mean is modification to make a template contain the valid postbit information for vB.org (the unlicenced user's status etc)...
what copyright? Just because somebody makes something doesn't make it copyrighted.....you have to actually copyright it.
Wrong - If you made it, it is copyright to you, no matter what anyone may tell you - You should still copyright it officially just to legally re-inforce it...
The way I see it....this is a joke. You want others to submit lots of styles and you are going to pick at them like a chicken wing and use what you want. Why not make your own style? The prizes are lacking incintive.

I would like to see styles that paople make because I lack the imagination to create one from scratch myself but seeing others makes my ideas start working.

Good luck with your "contest". You should make out real well as a result of it.
I think the prizes are good;)

They have explained why they are not making their own, and if you lack imagination, why make a style?:rambo: There are many places on the internet other than just that forum to gain style inspiration from if it is so important;)

Satan

[drives fast]

If you made it, it is copyright to you, no matter what anyone may tell you
sorry...you are wrong....if you don't copyright something....it is not copyrighted...no matter what anyone tells you. Simply putting the little "&copy" there doesn't mean anything.
Once they choose it, it becomes the property of vB.org - They can do what they want with it
and even if you were right.....and there are copyright issues, then vb.org cannot take posession of the style for the same reasons that nobody else could.
If you made it, it is copyright to you, no matter what anyone may tell you
That was a contradiction

Anyway....no worries....as I said....it will suit the vb.org real well....unless someone decides to make a stink over vb.org violating the style creators "copyright"

[Chris M]

sorry...you are wrong....if you don't copyright something....it is not copyrighted...no matter what anyone tells you. Simply putting the little "&copy" there doesn't mean anything.
I suggest you read the law - It clearly dictates that any works made by you are copyright to you, no matter whether you put a full blown "Copyright&copy2003 hellsatan" there or not...
and even if you were right.....and there are copyright issues, then vb.org cannot take posession of the style for the same reasons that nobody else could.
Yes they can - vB.org specifically state that the competition requires the entry submission of a style (or more) from you, when you acknowledge and willingly transfer copyright and ownership of the style to them if it is chosen - It is legal;)
That was a contradiction
Maybe it was...
Anyway....no worries....as I said....it will suit the vb.org real well....unless someone decides to make a stink over vb.org violating the style creators "copyright"
There should be no issue - vB.org simply stated that the conditions of them controlling the copyright and having ownership of the style are dependant on a credit being in the footer;)

Satan

[drives fast]

I would be interested in seeing this "law" you quote because I have seen no such thing.

it is no different than a patent or a registration of a trademark.....if you don't do it on paper....it doesn't exist and anyone can take it....copyright it, patent it, or register it on paper and take it from you before you have the chance.

I have seen it time and time again.....if you don't have anything on paper....you have no claim to it.

you are correct....the terms of the contest do say that you would turn over all rights to the style by submitting it....but you would need to own rights to it in order to do such a thing and then vb.org would need to get it on paper or it is still fair game.

I like a good discussion...this is great.

anyway...bottom line....if it isn't on paper...you have no claim to it. Anybody could claim to have created it before you and claim that you stole it from them. This is why it has to be on paper....there is no dispute to that and is the whole reason that coptrights, patents and registering of trademarks exists....to prove that you are in fact the owner.

Should I check into whether jelsoft has registered the vbulletin name? Should I check into whether the vbulletin software is actually copyrighted? If it is not on paper...anyone can steal it and get it copyrighted or register the trademark vbulletin name and then they would own it on paper and nobody could do anything about it. As I said....a simple claim and neat little mark does not prove ownership.

In order to avoid anyone getting mad....I will say tht all of my comments are IMO because I am not trying to start a war.

[filburt1]

Directly from the US Copyright office (http://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-general.html):
Your work is under copyright protection the moment it is created and fixed in a tangible form that it is perceptible either directly or with the aid of a machine or device.

[drives fast]

the fact that the statement doesn't stop at "created" supports what I have been saying

[drives fast]

from the same page you got that from it also say this:
Do I have to register with your office to be protected?
No. In general, registration is voluntary. Copyright exists from the moment the work is created. You will have to register, however, if you wish to bring a lawsuit for infringement of a U.S. work. See Circular 1, Copyright Basics, section ?Copyright Registration.?
so as I have said a couple times now....if I claim I have created something that you created but you do not put it on pager (copyrighted) I can claim that I created it a week before you and actually copyright it and you cannot do anything about it and I will actually be the one who can sue you for claiming it is yours.

these things are worded in such a way that can be confusing to many and many usually stop reading when they see what they think is the answer to their question. You have to keep reading because laws routinely contradict themselves and it is left up to the lawyers to argure it out.

if you don't register your work....you cannot complain if someone steals it and registers it as their own

[Chris M]

Actually if you claim some of my work, and I have documentable proof (such as date of creation of the work on my computer), then you will be prosecuted for fraud;)

So even if you register it, if someone else can actually prove they made it first, you have no legal standing and may be imprisoned...

Satan

[drives fast]

assuming that the person stealing your work is too incompetent to create documents and the like to say other wise.

bottom line folks...in the digital age.....you better register your work or someone can steal it from you.

The facts I have brought up are debatable in court but I guarantee...if I have a paper and you don't....you will lose.

I am not saying that I personally would do anything like this but I know it can be done and has been done.

that is all I am saying and the facts are the facts

[Chris M]

Again, you are wrong...

If you were to steal my work and pass it off as your own, and create false documents, you would still not be the legal copyright holder...

The reason is that the real copyright owner would in fact have original and un-edited documentation - I am sure there are ways of detecting recently added documents / forged creation dates, and at the end of the day, these lengths would be gone to if you were trying to sue me for trying to get my own work back...

Face it - Copyright belongs to the creator and owner of the work, whether they have a bit of paper to say it or not...And it would belong to vB.org as agreed by submitting a style...

Satan

[drives fast]

whatever helps you sleep at night.

if you write a php script and store it on your computer, it would have a creation date attached to it. however, if someone was able to get the code you wrote and simply change the date on their computer to a date prior to that and create it again it will have an earlier date attached to it.

if I go and register mine with the copyright department and you did not....I now own it. If you were to try to sue me for infringement...you would lose because I would have the paper to prove it was mine and I then could turn around and sue you.

My document would have an earlier date and I would hold the paper copyright....you would lose.

If it came down to witnesses....anyone can get liars and scumbags to support their story.

I will stop talking about this anymore since it seems to be breeding insanity.....this was all in the pretence of a good debate but it appears to be on the brink of out-of control.

thanks for the good debate guys....have fun

I sincerely hope you never have to try that defense in court

[Chris M]

Ok have fun yourself, but remember that I already explained what would happen in that case;) - Some people may also not only file what they have on one computer or in one location (i.e. taking screenshots and printing them out, photographs or making private diary/journal entries);):p

So I guess this is answered, so...

Satan

[Xenon]

Thx hellsatan for clearing up what right and whats wrong.

@drive fast: if you don't like the contest, you don't have to participate, but that's your opinion.
If you try to use wrong facts just to get other users on your side, shut up.
We won't ourself go to your threads and post hey lol, what crap have you posted...
So next time get the facts before posting or don't post!

thread closed

[Erwin]

Today at 03:50 AM drives fast said this in Post #17 (https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?postid=413020#post413020)
from the same page you got that from it also say this:

so as I have said a couple times now....if I claim I have created something that you created but you do not put it on pager (copyrighted) I can claim that I created it a week before you and actually copyright it and you cannot do anything about it and I will actually be the one who can sue you for claiming it is yours.

these things are worded in such a way that can be confusing to many and many usually stop reading when they see what they think is the answer to their question. You have to keep reading because laws routinely contradict themselves and it is left up to the lawyers to argure it out.

if you don't register your work....you cannot complain if someone steals it and registers it as their own

Actually, you are completely wrong.

Copyright is different to trademarks or patents - you do NOT need to register it. You do NOT even need to put up a notice, though people do it to ensure others respect their copyright.

If I write a book, compose a song, or design a website, the copyright belongs to me as the creator - automatically. It's part of common law though legislation in all jurisdictions protect this fundamental right too.

Hope this clears things up.

[Erwin]

By the way, I am doing 3 Master's subject in Internet Copyright Law, so I know a bit about this. :)