What can we do to make vBulletin.org a better place?

[tubedogg]

Some people have raised an issue lately that vB.org isn't what it used to be, or what it could potentially be. So, with that in mind, we have decided to ask the community: What can we do to make vBulletin.org a better place? What are your ideas of a great community?

Post your thoughts in this thread. Tell us what we can do to make it a better place.

[TECK]

kevin, i personally think the admins and mods at vb.org are doing a great job. they come up with new original ideas, try to get involved the members with various contests and new things.
the main atraction for people here at vb.org are the hacks. most of the time, people just go directly onto the forum and search for something new.

you know what it's missing here at vb.org? the proper display of announcements. most of the time people dont see it at all becausre they dont read it, so it's normal not to get a high response. let me tell you what i did me on my forums. at the top of each page i located an announcement with a query to display to content of an important announcement, like for example the hack of the month, etc. so in this way, people cannot miss it and they get excited.

take a look below for an example:

[TECK]

so once we have in place this system, i guarantee you people will interact more often.
also we must ecourage our community to submit ideas or cool things they would love to see created here.

we are hackers, so we love new cool things that we can participate onto, at vb.org.
is normal that the mods and admins dont get excited when they work hard to make a project and nobody interact.

[Erwin]

Originally posted by tubedogg
Some people have raised an issue lately that vB.org isn't what it used to be, or what it could potentially be. So, with that in mind, we have decided to ask the community: What can we do to make vBulletin.org a better place? What are your ideas of a great community?

Post your thoughts in this thread. Tell us what we can do to make it a better place.

It's already a great place. There is an apparent slump in posting because it would appear that a lot of members are posting on vB.com because of vB3 discussions there. Also, hackers are waiting for vB3 to come out.

For myself, I come here usually daily to see if there are any new hacks to inspect and possible install, and to answer any questions (if I know how to or if I have time). That's the only reason why I come. A community is what its members make it. I would love to see more people from vB.com post here. :) As it is, I find myself posting there more now, since posts here tend to be about inane subjects, or requests for hacks that can easily be found using the search function.

[Xenon]

Originally posted by Erwin


It's already a great place. There is an apparent slump in posting because it would appear that a lot of members are posting on vB.com because of vB3 discussions there. Also, hackers are waiting for vB3 to come out.

yes that's an important point.
i think vb3 discussions should be here, too. also posts of the developers about more hacking relevant infos like the new permission system so the hacker here can diskuss in more details here with the devs and other fellow hackers.

That's a wish from me as a Hacker and user on this board, not as mod ;)

[Neo]

I will have to say very little but I think the Release forum should be more modded. I have seen hacks posted that dont even have hacks in them and so on. This place is good but sometimes I come here and go.. what to do what to do. I personally think a clan system would be cool. Give a chance for hackers to start clans (after being accepted) and have hack offs ;)

[Xenon]

hmm, i think the clan system sounds intresting, can you explain a bit more detailed what you would do in this system?...

Releaseforum: Ok, i think i'll take a greater look at this in the future :)

[Neo]

Well it could be made really easy but here I go.

The groups for this site work like hacker organizations. A user on this site has the choice (or not) to start a new organization or request a new one made through a admin/mod.

Once it is created the organization is set a group leader that can add users that request to be in the group, delete them, add news for the group, and maybe some other feature like a mini forum.

group members can refer other members to join and have like you do with registration.. # of refer..

Also maybe in your postbit it will show which organization you are with.

These usually promote people to compete which is good on this site since it might preduce more hacks.

I myself currently have a system like this in production.

[Xenon]

hmm, sounds really intresting to me....
so groups can work together on creating hacks released by the whole group instead of one individual. which can lead to some greater add-ons not just simple hacks, really addons.

but as long as we have installed vb2 here it's not so easy for the admins to create these usergroups with their own forum and so on...

maybe the should use a beta of vb3 ;)

but i think it's a good idea if it's practicable to do

[Neo]

Actually it doesnt take creating a new forum. Just a new table with the basic info like

id,groupid,postuserid,title,comment,time

something like that.

[Xenon]

well if it's decided to add such a system maybe you can help coding ;)

ok, but we need more suggestions too :)

[Regs]

Review, adjust, and enforce the forum rules here. The maturity level at times here is appalling. Too many times I have seen hissy fits from various hackers over what ultimately means diddly squat.

Have hacks rated by well-known and respected VB team members. Not to be rude but 3345 responses to a "great hack" by 3345 kids means nothing to me.

~Regs.

[TECK]

Originally posted by Regs
Review, adjust, and enforce the forum rules here. The maturity level at times here is appalling. Too many times I have seen hissy fits from various hackers over what ultimately means diddly squat.

Have hacks rated by well-known and respected VB team members. Not to be rude but 3345 responses to a "great hack" by 3345 kids means nothing to me.

~Regs. i totally agree.

[Xenon]

you're thinking of a jury system?
so just Hackjury members can rate threads and also should rate threads?

[Dean C]

i dont like the sound of clans...

but i agree you should make sure the mods keep an eye on the forums cuz sooo many ppl post in the wrong places...

also we need to encourage more people to make hacks... i mean some of us *drops head in shame* hardly know any php... perhaps steps cud be taken for a staff member to teach php to people...

id certainly like to learn more about php and id like to code my own hacks too...

Perhaps get rid of the inactive mods too... i know they're busy but corey and jonathan rarely post in their respective forums... perhaps appoint someone like me who knows a lot about the vb templates system who can regularly post...

Also i think that we should have an experienced php coder who keeps an eye on the full releases forum and if people can't provide support then this staff member can..

----------------------

Just a few ideas :)

- miSt

[TECK]

i personally think a clan system will create only division in a community...
only the idea to have separate teams makes me wonder.. who get's other's team etc... i dont know. i never thought about it, but this is my first thing that passed through my mind.. division.

[Regs]

you're thinking of a jury system?
so just Hackjury members can rate threads and also should rate threads?A review system if you will, such that final hacks are reviewed in terms of adding loads, optimization, etc. I'm not talking about 'usefulness' here since that is something that depends on individual tastes. Set up a new forum or hack in a separate rating system only available to esteemed VB team members.

My vision is one where quality is separated from quantity.

Another suggestion is better user levels... I have no clue as to what a "tyro hacker" is or how that differs from an "ultimate hacker"... Is it based on post count? Is it based on the number of hacks submitted?

Promotion and demotion of mods is a good idea as well. Some definitely are not pulling their weight around here :rolleyes:

~Regs.

[TECK]

the reviews is an excellent idea. very good point indeed.

[filburt1]

I also think that the inundation of 2.2.xs are stifling things a bit (people don't want to apply a ton of hacks then have to do it all over again). That and vB3. Otherwise I think this is a great place. :)

[Logician]

Originally posted by tubedogg
Post your thoughts in this thread. Tell us what we can do to make it a better place.
IMHO the most important problem in vb.org is it does not befit well with its primary concern, that is "vbulletin hacks".

The number of hack threads is over 1200 in full releases section and it's impossible to track them with the existing system anymore. Hacks appear in the main page while they are released and the new release rate is so rapid that they expire even in 2 or 3 days. Then they are forgotten in the dark corners of Full Releases section and nobody runs into them unless they are accidently bumped. Hack db is a very nice idea but it's obvious it's not working very well to promote hacks.

IMO a new approach is needed urgently to handle the rapid hack release rate (which is a good thing BTW!)...

I'm not determined what would be the best approach but different methods can be thought like:
* Dividing the section into small pieces and seperating the small code modifications from major hacks (like Xenon always suggests)
* Putting hack releases under moderation
* Promoting more hacks in the main page dynamically. Top 10 hack list might be good idea but it just makes sures that the hacks in the list will be always in top 10 considering the traffic they get just because they are listed in that list. Different promotion tools can be coded such as listing top X hacks according to different criteria and randomly changing..
* In forum home there can be a small line choosing a hack randomly from the db with a few lines of comment and giving it a chance to be promoted..
* Regs's idea is also nice
* More hacks from different authors should be applied to vb.org. This would both increase the functionality here, encourage hacking and promote more hacks to vb members..

Well many others can be thought but I guess I made my point. The bottom line is: Full Releases section is a mass and does not suffice for the very high number of new hack releases anymore..

We have a chance: Vb3 will be released soon, so whatever new approach will be applied, it can at least be applied to VB3 hacks section..

[Dean C]

i agree with you entirely logician...

also id like to see you upgraded to mod my good friend... your one of the best hackers around .... ;)

- miSt

[TECK]

logician, that's why firefly spent a month to code the database.. it's a great tool to be used.
i use it all the time when i need an older hack.

[Xenon]

well but some users don't add their hacks to the database... :(

perhaps this could be changed:
noone can create thread in the fullreleases forum anymore, but threads are created automatically there when someone posts a hack in the Database.

also as Pal Logician said more subforums for Full releases could help, hacks which are already in the HackDB can be moved easily to the new subforums i think, they are already catagorized.

The Minihack forum i suggested some time ago is already planned Chen told me shortly after i became Mod here, but i think just for the vb3 hackin forums

More hacks from different authors should be applied to vb.org
intresting idea, but hard to do: the Admins don't have so much time, you can see this board runs at vb2.2.6, because Chen doesn'T have enough time to upgrade yet...

[g-force2k2]

if any help is needed i'd be more then happy to help the community...

As for more authors... thats up to them if they want to learn and try...

As for a rating system i dunno... there's a crucial factor of everyone's 'first' hack... i've seen many that are not to be mean but not necessarily hacks... like my own if you care to check out out... yeah i know pretty sad ;) but anyways first feedback from the community wasn't that great :p so i disappeared for a couple of months and returned more confident... as you can see i have made some improvement... but a 'hack ratings system' is like a 'bash new hackers' type deal... thats just my opinion...

As for and idea... perhaps if its someone's first hack there can be some kind of noticication (prefix?) so that members know its their first (second and third as well maybe?) so that they feel more comfortable and hackers will be easier....

Another idea... similiar to a new feature 'vb3 similiar threads' have a vb similiar hacks that would appear before confirming a hack release... this would maybe stop releases from being released in the past...

I don't know what else... just some input and my opinions... regards...

g-force2k2

[tubedogg]

Some very interesting ideas. I like the idea of a clan-type system though I do have misgivings about it dividing the community.

Some kind of PHP course would be stellar. If anyone who knows PHP well would like to volunteer to lead a course in PHP, please contact me or Firefly.

Dividing up the hacks would probably not be a bad idea. We'll look into that.

[Logician]

logician, that's why firefly spent a month to code the database.. it's a great tool to be used.
i use it all the time when i need an older hack.
I didnt say otherwise Pal.. Hack db is a great tool if you are searching for a specific hack. But most of users are just visiting the site to "fish" for the hacks. They surf Full Releases section and take a glance for recently bumped hacks, check site's first page to get top 10 hacks or recently released hacks and just try to see if there is a hack they can apply to their board. The existing system of vb.org is overwhelmed by the rapid hack release rate and is not sufficient to users for "fishing" hacks. Only around 50 hacks are on the surface, while 1150 are laying in the dusty corners of full releases section. The existing structure is just like an iceberg..

Cant you notice this from your own hacks? A hack sometimes gets 5 installers in 2 months, then someones asks a question and thread is bumped in full releases and it gets 10 installers in 2 days. Happens to me all the time..

I agree the functionality and necessity of hack db, but I'm just stating that vb.org needs other tools/structures to promote "forgetten" hacks more and helps the visitors "fish" well..

intresting idea, but hard to do: the Admins don't have so much time, you can see this board runs at vb2.2.6, because Chen doesn'T have enough time to upgrade yet...
I understand that. However if this is the case then it means vb.org needs more Admins. There are a lot of marvelous Mods around (like yourself) who are excellent vb hackers. I'm sure most of them can handle being Admins and easily handle these kind of chores..

Besides if a consesus about what will be done is maintained and management approves some of the proposals here, I'm sure many experienced hackers would happily help out coding/hacking of new vb.org additions/features.

Another idea... similiar to a new feature 'vb3 similiar threads' have a vb similiar hacks that would appear before confirming a hack release... this would maybe stop releases from being released in the past...
agreed 100%

My 2 cents.. Thx for listening..

[DrkFusion]

May I make a suggestion? Mabing making a catagory for 2.x when 3 comes out listing hacks, and support forums, so it can be organized better.

The review system is a good idea.

[Regs]

g-force2k2,

Consider the review system as something for hackers to aspire to. If new hackers get their feelings hurt because their first hack did not get reviewed or it was given a 'poor' review, then perhaps those users are not made out to be php programmers... I would think that to be good, one needs to be open to criticism and more importantly, to learn from what is said. Basically, it goes hand-in-hand with maturity... mature people will accept it, others... well... we've come full circle now to my other suggestion :D

I'm afraid that having clan-systems will cause divisions. It is human nature and something that has already kinda happened here... one only needs to look at the whole arcade drama to see how some groups can cause division, even when that was not the original intent.

FWIW, these are my own humble observations here so take them however you want :D

Cheers,

~Regs.

[tubedogg]

We will not be adding more admins. We will probably not be adding additional hacks unless we see a need for them. Installing them for the heck of it doesn't really help anything.

[Erwin]

Everyone has good points so far. :)

I really like the idea of a better organization of hacks, so the small and old but excellent hacks do not get lost in the mass. The hack db is excellent, but maye it should include all hacks. Also, more categories that are more specific would be great too. Maybe make a staff member responsible solely to maintain the db and move hacks to the correct category.

[hypedave]

1. Better Forum Organization for example why is there a beta sub forum in Full Releases

2. Better hack release rules, before any hack is to be released it should be released in the beta forum. How many hacks have been released in the beta forum in the past 3months?

3. Better hack guideline rules, I agree there should be a hack review system. Lots of hacks are released without a proper description etc.

4. The Php Tutorial sounds like a good idea I rather learn how to make a hack than beg someone to help me make one or remake one, I have tryed the request forum in the past and got lil or no luck at all.

5. Also if a member is to release a hack he/she should be able to provide support NO MATTER WHAT, and also provide support on this forum only. How many times have we seen hacks released and two days later the hack releaser doesnt provide support because A. if it worked on his test forum it shoould work on ours or b. he got tired of people complaining that the hack didnt install right, again that goes back to my suggestion that all hacks should be released in the Beta Releases first then after successful install and testing by a range of people it should get moved to full release

6. More organization in the Front Page, like you could categorize the hacks into a download section. The Hacks Database imo is cool, but it could be organized better

7. Oh yeah what if you could divide the hacks up by installer level, install time

well this is all I could think of at the moment, thanks for asking and listening

hypedave

[Lesane]

Originally posted by hypedave
5. Also if a member is to release a hack he/she should be able to provide support NO MATTER WHAT, and also provide support on this forum only.

hehe, i want to discuss that point again with you if you released a few hacks.

@tubedogg:
The staff organised some great ideas but it's probably hard to continue them. We are at July if we speak about 'hack of the month', we don't know nothing if we speak about 'contest for the new slogan'. Inform members about it. Why not putting someone else on the idea if the other don't have time for it anymore?

[hypedave]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Lesane
[B]

hehe, i want to discuss that point again with you if you released a few hacks.

[QUOTE]

nope I havent released any hacks at all, but I think its annoying for someone to relase a hack and not give us support for it at all, just because the hack worked on their test forum does not mean its gonna work on everyones forum, I can show you a prime example of a hack that was released and he gave no one support on it at all, then ask that he be contacted outside of vb.org for support and when we did that we still got no support, so why release a hack on a community like this if you are not gonna suport that hack at all, thats just not fair to the users that go installing the hack onto their board then come back to get support for a problem and the only answere they get is, its worked on my board you doing something wrong. or we wait for months and months of no support or comment at all. just my two cents.

[Xenon]

Originally posted by Lesane

We are at July if we speak about 'hack of the month', we don't know nothing if we speak about 'contest for the new slogan'. Inform members about it. Why not putting someone else on the idea if the other don't have time for it anymore?

Hack of the month: not enough members had participated, that's why it wasn't continued --> Look at postings by Teck here ;)

New slogan: stopped till vb3

[Lesane]

Originally posted by hypedave
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Lesane
[B]

hehe, i want to discuss that point again with you if you released a few hacks.

[QUOTE]

nope I havent released any hacks at all, but I think its annoying for someone to relase a hack and not give us support for it at all, just because the hack worked on their test forum does not mean its gonna work on everyones forum, I can show you a prime example of a hack that was released and he gave no one support on it at all, then ask that he be contacted outside of vb.org for support and when we did that we still got no support, so why release a hack on a community like this if you are not gonna suport that hack at all, thats just not fair to the users that go installing the hack onto their board then come back to get support for a problem and the only answere they get is, its worked on my board you doing something wrong. or we wait for months and months of no support or comment at all. just my two cents.

Yes, that's annoying indeed. But you can never force someone to give support or to continue his support.

[Lesane]

Originally posted by Xenon


Hack of the month: not enough members had participated, that's why it wasn't continued --> Look at postings by Teck here ;)


:disappointed:

Originally posted by Xenon

New slogan: stopped till vb3

Glad to hear that.

[Dean C]

well id like to volunteer myself to be mod for the "Template Questions and Button Requests" forum...

i have a comprehensive knowledge of the vbulletin template system and im sure i could give more support and dedicate more time than jonathan and corey have available :)

_______________

Swiftly moving on... the hacks database definately needs to be more organized and so do the full releases forum... im interested as to see what unfolds :)

- Mist

[TECK]

Originally posted by Xenon
Hack of the month: not enough members had participated, that's why it wasn't continued --> Look at postings by Teck here ;)

New slogan: stopped till vb3
Xenon is referring to this post:
https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?postid=301700#post301700

also, i think is a good idea to have Hack Reviews.
there are to many hacks released just for fun with alot of code errors, bad queries, unorganised code structure, etc.
so the review will give a direct apercu (short view) on it's contents.
it's the code reliable or robust? does it kill your server by generating a huge ammount of queries? could you make it more compact by eliminating some steps? the +? the -?
every hack should have a link to: Read this Hack Reviews.

if i would be a hacker and someone would tell me to do it in another way, i would thank him for teaching me a better way, so the next time i dont make the same mistake.

[TECK]

Originally posted by Mist
well id like to volunteer myself to be mod for the "Template Questions and Button Requests" forum...

i have a comprehensive knowledge of the vbulletin template system and im sure i could give more support and dedicate more time than jonathan and corey have available :)

_______________

Swiftly moving on... the hacks database definately needs to be more organized and so do the full releases forum... im interested as to see what unfolds :)

- Mist mist, vBulletin staff will contact the apropriate people they need, when they need someone.
usually they look among posters to see who have the most experience to cover the opening.

[hypedave]

Originally posted by Lesane
Yes, that's annoying indeed. But you can never force someone to give support or to continue his support.

then why should vbulletin.org staff allow those to release a hack and not give support. Think about it you have a great community. so if one person released a hack and doesnt even bother at all to give support. then you have someone jump on the band wagon and say okay the staff here doesnt care if I release a hack and not try to provide support on it at all so im gonna do that same ok. then all of a sudden you have lets say 85% hacks released and support provided at all. You never know it bound to happen, I mean personally I have never submmited a hack before but if I did those would be the things i look at if Johny submitted his hack and didnt provide support then im gonna do the same thing to only becasue the staff allowed johnny to submit one and not provide support. I believe, again this is my opinion only that in order to keep a community like this successful there must be some type of guideline in place for submittng hacks because think about it if one person submits a hack and doesnt even provide support for it all in no shape form or fashion, how will that set an example to the first time vb hackers?

I mean yeah you can't force someone to provide support but its not fair to the community for someone to release a hack and not provide support at all when their only comment is, it worked on my board so " it should work on yours as well "

again just my two cents

[Xenon]

well you should think of another point hyperdave:
Most of the hacks are written to work on the board the hack writers own, just for them.

So if they also post them here so some other can perhaps use it, then it's good, if they provide support for their hacks, it's better.
But we cannot force em to do so, because then some can say: ok i won't post a hack anymore just because i don't have the time to give support.

2 cents here ;)

...Hack review system sounds really good for me :)

[tubedogg]

We are not going to force people to provide support for their hacks. First, we simply don't have the manpower to do it, and second, some people won't post hacks if they are required to provide support. If you are not going to provide support, it must be stated up front (as I think is in the Full Releases rules). That's why the community in general needs to help each other, so if someone doesn't want to provide support, others help those who need help with the hack.

[Erwin]

Some hacks are so simple that the hack releaser may state explicitly that he or she will not be supporting it. If you don't like it, then the advice would be to not install the hack at all. Also, most hack releasers here have day jobs, and have busy lives, and cannot afford to come daily to this site to support their hacks. Especially when most of the time, it's the installer who has made a silly error by forgetting a } to cause a parse error or something like that. :)

Hack reviews would be great. I also agree that all hacks should probably be released as beta first, and be moved to full release by a mod once it is obvious that it works.

[hypedave]

Originally posted by tubedogg
We are not going to force people to provide support for their hacks.

Did I say to Force people to provide support?

QUOTE]Originally posted by tubedogg
First, we simply don't have the manpower [/QUOTE]
If you don't have the man power then why not just ask, im sure there are alot of capable people of helping.

Originally posted by tubedogg
some people won't post hacks if they are required to provide support. I could take the comment and stretch a thousand miles, but at least they could follow rule #5 right?

Originally posted by tubedogg
If you are not going to provide support, it must be stated up front (as I think is in the Full Releases rules).
And how many hacks have been released where rule number 5 was some how over looked?

Originally posted by tubedogg
That's why the community in general needs to help each other, so if someone doesn't want to provide support, others help those who need help with the hack.
I agree and I know its not a easy job to take time and support someone elses hack. But I think it becomes a problem when someone steps in to help support someones else's hack then get flammed at by the original person the wrote hack, simply for helping someone out. I mean hey obviously im not getting anywhere with this but I do believe you asked the question " What can we do to make vBulletin.org a better place? " sorry I took time to stand up for the user's who dont want to voice their opinions.

[hypedave]

Originally posted by Erwin
Some hacks are so simple that the hack releaser may state explicitly that he or she will not be supporting it.
I agree but thats way hacks should aslo be rated by the level of knowledge it takes to intall. for example

Beginner = A Beginner can install this hack

you get the point right ?

Originally posted by Erwin
If you don't like it, then the advice would be to not install the hack at all. by some of these hack descriptions these days it hard to tell wether you will like it or not?


Originally posted by Erwin
Also, most hack releasers here have day jobs, and have busy lives, and cannot afford to come daily to this site to support their hacks. Especially when most of the time, it's the installer who has made a silly error by forgetting a } to cause a parse error or something like that. :) Thats very understandable cause believe me when I start to learn and release my first major hack I may log on every other day to provide support. but I would clearly state that in the first post as well, don't wanna do like some people and release a hack and break rule 5 do I

[Admin]

Originally posted by Neo
I will have to say very little but I think the Release forum should be more modded. I have seen hacks posted that dont even have hacks in them and so on. This place is good but sometimes I come here and go.. what to do what to do. I personally think a clan system would be cool. Give a chance for hackers to start clans (after being accepted) and have hack offs ;)
Once vBulletin 3 is released this will be much more feasible, and who knows, we might even use that new system. :)

As for the releases forum, we've had an idea to moderate it a while ago, but it was dropped because we felt we have enough man power to moderate in an after-post manner. We'll see. :)

[Admin]

Originally posted by Xenon
yes that's an important point.
i think vb3 discussions should be here, too. also posts of the developers about more hacking relevant infos like the new permission system so the hacker here can diskuss in more details here with the devs and other fellow hackers.
Good idea, we might add a vBulletin 3 forum here soon!

[Xenon]

ahh sounds good
* Xenon hopes to get new hacking relevant infos about vb3 soon ;)

hmm, i have another suggestion, not sure if it's a good idea or not:
don't allow users to download a hack before they have clicked on install.

[Goldknight]

I agree with Hypedave about hack support. That s why I admire Lesane, g-force2k2, and several hackers who provide support most of time. I have been visit here less and less due to hackers' attitudes. Sitepointforums.com have better attitude and ethical staffs and members, I like how they treat others and help others if need instead of "I have my own hack and I refuse to share with you muhahaha" or complain about someone steal others' ideas. More I visit here, more I back off. Also if I release the hack and I will support it until my computer die on me or I die either way. It is ethical and professional attitude for anyone to do that. If one corporate release the new digital TV and refuse to support it, do you think that it will stay up in the market? People are not stupid, they need the support, if they get support then whoever release will get some applauses or pat on the back. It is not that hard... It is good practice for anyone...

As for Regs, he/she have good point. I know that this board have potential and could be better than UBB. *shrug*

Neo's suggestion about "heavy modded" I agree one hundred percent with him about these, I have seen many unnessecary flames, complains and many things at release forum.

No offense to any of staffs at here, I admire their works and dedication but unfortunately that more than half staffs here are inactive... I check thur these staffs' profile for "last post by" or numbers of posts... that one I think need to straight out and deal with it. We have over 20,000 members now, it will be nice to have many active staffs to keep them in the line as what Sitepointforums.com staffs did. There is a unwritten rule on the stone that staffs are suppose to be more active than members does. *shrug* I hope I ll not flame by others about this, I only speak my mind and nothing more.

[tubedogg]

First, the staff here has no control over what users do until after the fact. I'm not sure what you mean by implying the staff here is unethical, but I don't appreciate it as I'm sure the rest of the staff don't.

The number of posts made by a staff member is not an indication of their activity as a moderator. We do plan to do some weeding but many moderators do actually do work without posting.

[Goldknight]

Sorry if I m not clear, I have no beef with staffs at here, they re wonderful and hard workers. I have no questions about staffs at here but as for members, they need to think before post and there is no need to flames others or insults or even complains. It is getting old.

[hypedave]

thanks Goldknight I had a feeling that out of 21,000+ members I wasn't alone. Yeah it does get annoying to get support on a hack only to search through 3+ pages of two hackers arguing to each other about coding that either one didnt get permission to re-release with coding improvements or a hacker arguing with a hack installer over some commense parse code area.

Im sure we have seen alot of those threads right where the staff never stepped in to resole an issue of two hacker arguing, I agree with tubedoggs comment in doing some weeding.

Then also if there is to be a hack review system, why not implement a hacker review system or hacker hacks portfolio system, that way one can easily learn about the hacker's background I guess. Or what about put something in place like my favorite hacker where a person can get an email update if their favorite hacker has released a new hack, you know somethng similiar like when a hack has been updated and you get that email that its been updated.

[Xenon]

add hackers to your buddylist, and you'll already recieve an email if this hacker releases a new hack...

[hypedave]

Originally posted by Xenon
add hackers to your buddylist, and you'll already recieve an email if this hacker releases a new hack...

thanks for that tip, never knew that was possible, is there like a thread somewhere around here stating that if you add someone to your buddy list you will get an email when the submit a new hack? If so im sorry I missed that thread some how.

thanks

[Xenon]

the announcement forum is really helpful for such tips or rules to find:

https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38423

;)

[hypedave]

Originally posted by Xenon
the announcement forum is really helpful for such tips or rules to find:

https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38423

;)


I do realise that the annoucemnet forum is really helpful, but when you have things at the top like.

Forum Statistics,
Welcome back panel,
Currently Active Users,
Active User's today,
Private Messages

and then your $forumbit

dont you think its a lil crowded at the top? Normally when I scroll down to get to the actual forumbit I do think that annoucement sometimes it easy to over look when trying to get past all the stuff at the top, im sure others think the same as well.

Isnt there a feature in vbulletin called annoucements, im sure people would see that quicker than use of the annoucment forum.

[Erwin]

I see that the "This author will support his hack" sign is up and working. :)

FWIW, I've ticked all of my hacks to "yes". It's a good idea - this way, members can't complain if the author doesn't reply to posts.

[Neo]

Originally posted by FireFly

Once vBulletin 3 is released this will be much more feasible, and who knows, we might even use that new system. :)

As for the releases forum, we've had an idea to moderate it a while ago, but it was dropped because we felt we have enough man power to moderate in an after-post manner. We'll see. :)

Yeah I was thinking that since VB3 already has something that.

Thanks for the responce. :)

[Logician]

While you start changing:

Please make a clear rule which restricts releasing codes that is not written by you. I'm not talking about taking an idea and rewriting a similiar hack by your own codes and algorithm, but this is not same as rereleasing other hacker's vb hacks with very slight modifications, releasing/integrating non-vb third party PHP scripts which are owned by other people or just creating an other hack thread for someone else's hack without his permission in the name of "rerelease", "version 2", "add-on" etc.

Although it's stated that "the released hacks are copyrighted to their respective owners" in the footer of vb.org, there are too many incidents that this rule does not seem to be enforced here..

Our sharing codes here makes some people think that they "own" the code and they can do whatever they want with that code which is neither correct, nor legal. Even in freeware software author holds all the legal rights to his code, just gives the free usage/distribution of the code, that is it.

It should be clearly stated in hack threads, in the header of full releases section, while downloading a hack or while registering this site etc. that dowloaded hacks are for vb.org members personal usage only and they can NOT be distributed, sold, re-released. etc. without author's permission. Besides this rule should be enforced vehemently.

There are too many incidents that many hacks (or very slightly modified versions) are re-released by different members without author's permission and I have the impression that these threads are not dealed appropriately..

I believe it should NOT be only hack authors clicking "I AGREE" buttons here.

Thanks for listening..

[TECK]

very good point logician.

[Erwin]

I agree. All updated hacks should stay within the SAME original thread for the original hack.

[Xenon]

i allways try to merge threads whenever i see an updated hack ;)

[Erwin]

That's why you are a great mod, Xenon! ;) Keep up the good work!

[Xenon]

Thank you Erwin, it always feels good to hear that own work is good :)

I'll try to do my best in future,too :)
And i'm sure we all will do :)

[tubedogg]

Originally posted by Logician
While you start changing:

Please make a clear rule which restricts releasing codes that is not written by you.I believe this is against the rules now. At any rate, you must have permission to rerelease a hack by someone else in that manner and we will remove threads that don't meet that criteria as I believe we have in the past.

[Logician]

Originally posted by tubedogg
I believe this is against the rules now. At any rate, you must have permission to rerelease a hack by someone else in that manner and we will remove threads that don't meet that criteria as I believe we have in the past.
If this is the case (well it should be), then thank you. But threads like this (https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?s=&threadid=43937) or this (http://www.vbulletin.org/hacks/index.php?s=&action=showhack&hackid=580) gives the impression that some people didnt know the rule and the rule is not enforced successfully either.. They are just examples (no offence to anyone) and I recall there are more threads of this kind..

Putting a reminder about the subject in the screen someone submits a hack or dealing with these kinds of threads rigorously might help better..

[Xenon]

well that's true pal

we will work on the releaseforum...

have merged two threads again ;)

[Logician]

thx great Mod ;)

[Dean C]

hehe... good work xenon...

im liking the fact ure taking our advice... good call tubedogg :)

Regards

- miSt

[Dean C]

Originally posted by TECK
mist, vBulletin staff will contact the apropriate people they need, when they need someone.
usually they look among posters to see who have the most experience to cover the opening.

i know that... just offering to help ;)

[Erwin]

What do you think should happen when vB3 is released? Should anyone be allowed to update another author's hack to vB3, or should permission be seeked first? What does everyone think?

[Xenon]

well, if a hack is just updated, you'll have to ask before posting it in the new vb3 forum.

but if you rewrite it, because of new filestructures of vb3 files
you can call it "yours"
but you should mention Idea by...

that's just my opinion, we haven't talked about that intern now..

[sparky2]

I would appreciate it if we could adopt a convention where hacks are ALWAYS made available as straight code...

...and the "hand-holding installer version" would be the "optional" version.

[g-force2k2]

i really couldn't agree with Logician anymore in his previous post (the last one on page 4) he brings up all valid points... and i know this happens as well... no offense to any hacker... but i make sure that i put in my copyrights so someone doesn't release the same thing just slightly altered... theres been instances of a power hack release (what like six times?) and i definately think there should be a division btw small hacks and larger hacks...

Another point as for the hack releases from vb2 - vb3 i believe that to get permission to release someone else hack (even though modified for vb3 code) should get the permission of the author(s) of that hack before doing so. If they don't respond in a certain amount of time then allow them... but im sure that many hackers have their signature hacks that they don't want to have someone else just simply import over to vb3... goes on the same line as just 'intergration' of a hack...

vb3 may be popular at its release... but exactly how many ppl will turn directly to the beta release to use as a stabilized forum? im sure the 2.2.X series will be around for some time... just some of my other points...

btw nice job on the support addition to hack releases... regards...

g-force2k2

[Erwin]

Originally posted by g-force2k2
Another point as for the hack releases from vb2 - vb3 i believe that to get permission to release someone else hack (even though modified for vb3 code) should get the permission of the author(s) of that hack before doing so. If they don't respond in a certain amount of time then allow them... but im sure that many hackers have their signature hacks that they don't want to have someone else just simply import over to vb3... goes on the same line as just 'intergration' of a hack...

I agree with that protocol too. :) The good news is that most of my hacks are external files, which should work with vB3 (I think) already barring some crazy new way of checking usergroup permissions in global.php. ;)

[Dan Flynn]

I also agree! I feel that the time and hard work that goes into some of these incredible hacks you guys come up should be respected and not taken for granted for some wannabee or even just some lazy hacker.

I see who's real and who's not and they respect each other and note credit were credit should be noted. I feel fortunate to benefit from the hackers hard work.

Thanks

[Logician]

i believe that to get permission to release someone else hack (even though modified for vb3 code) should get the permission of the author(s) of that hack before doing so.
I agree with that protocol either..

If they don't respond in a certain amount of time then allow them...
Well.. Please also consider the number of hacks some Authors have. I guess I have 25 and Firefly was more than 50 when I last checked.. Can you consider the work and time we should commit for importing the hacks to vb3? So instead of the term "certain amount of time", I would rather "if hack author didnt respond at all or explicitly allowed him to do so". :)

[Neo]

I also think that there should be something that is obvious for new users so that if they come here and start threads asking why they cant download anything... they will already know instead of having 5-10 new threads a week about it...

[leah_zero]

Howdy folks, great ideas in this thread you've got going here, it's an enjoyable read. I would like to add my two cents as a long-time vB user and hack enthusiast (that is, I love to add hacks to my forum, but couldn't write them myself to save the world)...

The thing that puts me off the most about vB.org is something that's already been mentioned: the fairly ubiquitous absence of peer review on hacks. I have often come here searching for a particular sort of hack, found several versions by different authors, read entirely through their support threads...and ended up leaving empty-handed, because beyond the author's initial posts and some patches to the hack, the only feedback I could find was people saying "Doesn't work" or "Great hack." Praise is great, it seems to be one of the few rewards of the difficult task of making hacks, but when praise is doled out too liberally and unaccompanied by constructive criticism, or when criticism is the generic "Doesn't work" sort, both become meaningless. I often find myself reduced to searching for a hack author's own forum and, if I can find it, registering a throwaway account just to see if a hack he/she has released actually works as promised. It's clutter for their database, clutter for my inbox and memory, and altogether too much trouble to go through to test out every hack that looks promising. It's quite disappointing to dig up some wonderful-looking hack, only to find no feedback on it but "It doesn't work" or "It works for me." What does that actually tell anyone?

Here's what I think. Hack authors put blood, sweat and tears into their creations. As hack users, we owe it to them to give something back: constructive criticism and feedback. I've decided that from now on (and retroactively, if I can find some specific old hacks), for every hack I install, I'm going to comment in its support thread whether or not it works for me after a reasonable effort at installation, what version of vB I'm using it on, any problems I ran into with installation or usage, and so on. Whenever I upgrade to a new version of vB, or just periodically, I intend to comment in those threads on whether or not the hack still works, and just to let the author know that I still appreciate the extra functionality they've let me add to my forum.

I don't think this is something you could specifically code into vB.org, but rather an attitude I hope to see espoused by vB.org members in the future. What simpler way to separate the wheat from the chaff in hack releases than genuine user feedback? vB.org already has features in place to record whether or not you've installed a hack...why not check back in every few weeks or months and show some support (or voice your concerns) on the hacks that make this great forum software even better?

I hope I've not offended anyone. In the end, I will no doubt continue to derive usefulness from vB.org no matter what you do (besides go offline, that is), but I did feel moved to throw in my opinion on the state of things around here.

Thanks for reading.

Humbly,
Leah

[Erwin]

Originally posted by leah_zero
I've decided that from now on (and retroactively, if I can find some specific old hacks), for every hack I install, I'm going to comment in its support thread whether or not it works for me after a reasonable effort at installation, what version of vB I'm using it on, any problems I ran into with installation or usage, and so on. Whenever I upgrade to a new version of vB, or just periodically, I intend to comment in those threads on whether or not the hack still works, and just to let the author know that I still appreciate the extra functionality they've let me add to my forum.

That is a fantastic attitude, one which I try to adopt too, when I find the time. :)

[Dean C]

thats a very nice attutitude indeed leah... but not every1 has that enthusiasm...

[N9ne]

Some great ideas here, on the first page, was it Neo that said something about a clan of hackers? I think that's an awesome idea and I'd love to see that happen, it would make for some amazing hacks, and some hacks being made faster and so on...

[Dean C]

id hate to have a clan on here...

- miSt

[tubedogg]

I'm not sure "clan" is the right word. I don't know if any of you visit DeviantArt.com, but they have a project called Mosaics. Basically, someone posts a template, and then people work on a section of the template, and the result is a mosaic of a bunch of people's work.
http://www.deviantart.com/?tier=mosaics
I'm thinking something along those lines, where a bunch of people work on a "template" (that is, a hack idea) to produce a hack. It wouldn't be able to be as free-form as the mosaic idea, otherwise it would never get done and wouldn't work worth ++++, but you get the idea.

[Diva]

Six pages to comment on and my eyes are buggy. Or is that Mist's sig? ;)

1. I bought this board because of the great support. That's what sold me, at least. When the hacks were split off, and the support was split, I was worried. I would love more of a support forum. Most hackers have been wonderful, and I appreciate their help. But I think more of a support forum would be great for the hacks that do not have any support. I realize there is VB3 coming out, but I believe many people are going to keep their current version until the bugs are worked out and the hacks updated. Therefore, I hope support for the current hacks will be kept up to date.

2. I didn't post here except for help because I never interacted with members and mods otherwise. If you want a community, then we shoud treat it as such. For instance, The Lounge. What type of conversations do you want? Is it a place to talk to eachother as members? Maybe someone should take turns posting there to keep the chit chat going. [Great PC, Teck :p].

3. If you are going to rate the hacks, I hope it's in another forum. I'm not a kid and to read that my compliment isn't as valuable didn't sit right with me. One compliments the coding and the other compliments what it does. Personally I think it's just as important that someone enjoys what the hack does. I may not know how to do a hack, but I enjoy each hack that I install and appreciate the work that went into it, even if someone thinks the coding is 'messy'.

4. All this talk of clans and making people click on installed worries me. I may download a hack, and then find that it isn't right for me. I would like to have the choice on whether I want to say that I have this hack. When I hear about people not allowing hacks and splitting into clans, my only concern is that this board needs to have people come together. If I ask for help, but someone from a 'clan' isn't around, then I'm back where I started.

5. I do think that people get mighty petty on the hacks. We should be supportive of eachothers' efforts. I respect that the original author should be stated in an 'updated' hack, but here are two instances that need to be considered:

A. Someone makes a hack that honestly does not know of a 'simular' hack. The second hack is just as worthy of being published as the first. It may offer something different, that someone wants.

B. A hack was created over a year ago and the original author is no longer posting. What happens then? Can a person update the hack with a mention of the original authors' name? [like the Birthday (https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showthread.php?s=&threadid=20344&perpage=15&display=&pagenumber=1) in thread hack]. Or is it back to the request board?

I'm really starting to enjoy my time here, and try to come here through out the day. There are some great people here and I enjoy chatting with them. I can't cook, much less make a hack. But I hope my support as a member counts.

PS: Who else here want's to spank DrkFusions' avatar? :rolleyes:

[g-force2k2]

one suggestion tubedogg that could make things interesting... when releasing a hack maybe allow two ppl to release it... ie:

when Sinecure and Xenon made the reason for edit hack... it was a combination of their two efforts... and thats great... im sure they both agree that it was a (let me emphasize) 'team effort'

so i would personally like to see an option for allowing the release of a hack to be a shared option where both users get equal credit (maybe hard) but perhaps both get credit in their profiles...

in this sense it would led to the future of team work and bringing the community closer... imo this would be a great idea... i know i would use this feature for helping hackers learn how to hack and it can be a 'feel good' type of things ;) just another of my opinions... regards...

oh plus the support issue may be resolved in some cases... two ppl are always better then one ;) just my ideas...

g-force2k2

[Xenon]

g-force very right, that hack was a team effort :)
but now it's not easy to mak such hacks, because just one person can upload the newest version or edit it in the db (that was a problem i didn't think of. Ok now it's easy for me, because i'm a mod ;))

so i think your idea is very good for thos team hacks and also if someone else should upgrade hacks from original authors.

[Erwin]

That's a good idea - a hack that has 2 or more authors, so when the install is clicked, it goes to both the authors' profiles.

[Xenon]

that's also was i had in mind with the clan system.

a clan hack can be edited by all members of the clan (or the ones a clanleader allowed ;))

[Dean C]

i still wouldn't like to have a clan system....

- miSt

[Chris M]

I think something that would be good is some kind of "Links Directory" like they have @vB.com, except with a difference...

There would be a link in the user's profile to their Link entry/entries, and they could fill out a Site Description for the site, plus contact details, Site History, vBulletin Version, Number of Hacks Installed, and have a tiny thumbnail picture of a Site Screenshot...Then others can view their site profile contained within the Link Directory, and rate the site, and read up about it...

The Link Directory would then have categories, which you can add your Site Profile to...

:)

Satan

[Dean C]

would be quite easy to do too ^ :D

- miSt

[hypedave]

Originally posted by hellsatan
I think something that would be good is some kind of "Links Directory" like they have @vB.com, except with a difference...

There would be a link in the user's profile to their Link entry/entries, and they could fill out a Site Description for the site, plus contact details, Site History, vBulletin Version, Number of Hacks Installed, and have a tiny thumbnail picture of a Site Screenshot...Then others can view their site profile contained within the Link Directory, and rate the site, and read up about it...

The Link Directory would then have categories, which you can add your Site Profile to...

:)

Satan


hey thats sounds like a great idea!!!

[Chris M]

:D

Oh Chen...:)

Satan

[Learner29]

Originally posted by tubedogg
Some people have raised an issue lately that vB.org isn't what it used to be, or what it could potentially be. So, with that in mind, we have decided to ask the community: What can we do to make vBulletin.org a better place? What are your ideas of a great community?

Post your thoughts in this thread. Tell us what we can do to make it a better place.

Hi tubedogg (da expert),
Hi All....

I hestitated pretty much before writing this post....

While I sincerely CARE for vbulletin.org and should not miss the opportunity of saying what should be done to improve it, I am at the same time afraid of stepping on anyone's toes...

I will try my best, please forgive me if I am too harsh ..

1 - The forums on vbulletin.org are DEAD slow.... I take part on many many forums, and vbulletin.org is one of the slowest ....

now this is the problelm ... where is the solution I am proposing ???

Solution: Move vbulletin.org to faster and better connected servers ......

But who will cover the expenses ?? vbulletin.org does not place ads or banners on the forums pages ??? ........

Answer : I


I will tell you where to get this money from.....


Keep reading with me :

2 - sooo many requests stay not honoured for days and days till they are totally forgotten though the question really does not take more than a minute of any one of many hundreds of experts coming to this forum regularly and reading the request....

If you pay those that DO help, everybody will be faaaaaar more eager to help, especially, if you pay those that help you based on user evaluation of the helper....

again, I will tell you where you get this money from...


I will stop here with the problems and tell you the solutions to those....

Money...

and you can get lots of it ....

Look how many thousands of people come every month to this site vbulletin.org, and they take all the hacks they wish, and even often without saying thank you to the author of the hack who maybe spent many many long nights working on the hack....

For me, the hacks are THE ESSENCE of vbulletin, and Honestly, if I did not have access to those hacks, I would not be using vbulletin, but rather ANY of the many tens of similar FREE software available from any of the many scripts sites like Hotscripts.com


Let me be brief : we pay 85 dollars a year for the license of vbulletin..... would it be too much if we pay 10 dollars more to get access to vbulletin.org and all those great hacks ???

of course not...

that is less than one dollar per month...

If you think this is too much, imagine PPN or Logician spending the whole night working on a hack that you will download and use ....... Does not he deserve you invite him to a cup of coffee ??

well, that is it !!!

Make access to vbulletin.org and the hacks PAID..... 1 dollar per month or 10 dollars per year is a reasonable price for me...

That is my personal opinion..... and I hope you simply accept it as an opinion....

[Dean C]

good god no... ill leave here faster than maurice greene on speed if the hacks are paid...

- miSt

[Xenon]

hmm, i don't see the problem..
as i know vb.org runs on the same server as vb.com does.
and all pages loads very fast, so i think the speed problem is your ISP

[Learner29]

Originally posted by Xenon
hmm, i don't see the problem..
as i know vb.org runs on the same server as vb.com does.
and all pages loads very fast, so i think the speed problem is your ISP

ja vielleicht .... aber...

(yes maybe, but ..)

as I said I am on many forums and some others load much faster... It still could be my ISP...

[NTLDR]

Originally posted by Learner29
as I said I am on many forums and some others load much faster... It still could be my ISP...

What ISP are you with? I regularly get pages timing out and refusing to load here, I have a tendancy to think its my ISP though.

[Chris M]

I use Tiscali, and never have any problems:)

Satan

[DrkFusion]

I made a Links Directory :) I hope vb.org uses it lol

-Arunan

[Chris M]

Me too!:)

Satan

[DrkFusion]

Originally posted by hellsatan
Me too!:)

Satan
I love spammed ham too : :bunny:

I think something new and interactive for vb.org will livein the place up.

-Arunan

[Chris M]

Hmmm...We already have a Chat...

What did you have in mind?

Satan

[Neo]

New & Interactive?? On the web???? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAAH!?!?!?!?!?

Thats a good one noX

[Chris M]

:p

Satan

[Erwin]

Originally posted by hellsatan
:p

Satan

:)

Satan will improve vB.org? :)

[Neo]

You are all so funny I could kill again :)

[DrkFusion]

Originally posted by Neo
New & Interactive?? On the web???? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAAH!?!?!?!?!?

Thats a good one noX
:(
-Arunan

[Xenon]

please become more serious, it's also a serous thread not the lounge ;)

@learner: German?
Also ich h?tte t-online anzubieten und keine probleme vom speed

[Learner29]

Hallo Stephan ,

When I read the few posts above this, I could well understand why you wrote :
Originally posted by Xenon
please become more serious, it's also a serous thread not the lounge ;)


and I agree with you...

as to your question,
Originally posted by Xenon
@learner: German?
Also ich h?tte t-online anzubieten und keine probleme vom speed

nein, ich bin kein Deutsch aber ich mag Deutsch. Ich wohne im Schweiz und ich hatte ein bisschen Deutsch im GB gelernt auch.

;-)

[Chris M]

Also...Das ist prima!

Auch mag ich Deutsch, aber kann ich nur ein bisschen sprechen;)

@Erwin - Of course I will:D Im radical enough;)

Satan

[FleaBag]

Take a look at www.ubbdev.com and what they do, their' software is antique, but their' community is great. I'd be more than willing to join such an effort at vB.org. :)

[DrkFusion]

Not to be rude to mods or admins, but I think they should become more active, after all they are the people who set a good impression on the community itself.

Like at ubbdev, there are constant updates, about technology, world etc and not just the script, this will make it a more enjoyable community, if you again see UBB Dev, there are active topics, and discussions every day, its because they ALOT to talk about other than just hacks. I know my pointless posts will reduce if this increases.

Again not to be rude, I appreciate all your work, but people are not going to be able to instantly notice that you helped me, or another, the main page is there to attract, you guys must attract and livin this place up.

My thoughts
-Arunan

[Dean C]

i couldn't agree more...

Xenon is an excellent mod.. he's done so much on here ...

But the rest of the mods aren't very active at all..

PPN is the second most active but im sure he's busy helpin with vb3 :D

- miSt

[Chris M]

Well Chen does have alot to do...

Sinecure and Steve Machol are pretty active...

Some though, like chrispadfield or eva2000 arent very active at all:(

SaintDog, Xenon & PPN are the most active:)

Satan

[Steve Machol]

Originally posted by hellsatan
Sinecure and Steve Machol are pretty active...
I'm active, but since I'm not a PHP programmer I'm afraid I'm not very useful with hacking question.

[Chris M]

Hehe...But you are useful for interrogating for vB3 information:p

Satan

[Steve Machol]

I have my uses - limited as they are! ;)

[Chris M]

*uses powers of interrogation*

* Chris M says to Steve - "Tell me all about vB3"...:devious:

:p

@All - Why dont the admins integrate Arunan's "Advanced Links Directory" hack into vB.org, and modify it a bit?:)

Satan

[Xenon]

Thanks for all the kind words :)
It's not so easy with limited free time to be around here as long as i want, but those posts really help so we like the job here :)

[Chris M]

I like it here too:)

vB.org is a proper Community:)

Satan

[Dean C]

Originally posted by hellsatan
Well Chen does have alot to do...

Sinecure and Steve Machol are pretty active...

Some though, like chrispadfield or eva2000 arent very active at all:(

SaintDog, Xenon & PPN are the most active:)

Satan

Sinecure isn't active at all anymore...

Steve has become active lately which is good to see :D

And saintdog isn't active here anymore. Probably because he has so much to do with VH and vbT :D

- miSt

[Chris M]

Sinecure has been on:)

SaintDog must be busy with vBT i suspect;)

And yes - It is good to see an active Steve:D

Satan

[Dean C]

^ No sinecure hasn't....

- miSt

[Chris M]

Im sure he was;)

Satan

[Xenon]

hey hey come on boys ;)

Sinecure is around, last visit yesterday, but he don't post much this time...

[Chris M]

See:)

I havent spoken to Sinecure in a while...I wonder why he is so silent?:confused:

Satan

[Erwin]

Because silence is golden. The less you say, the more important it is when you do say something. ;)

[John]

I'm probably coming in on this thread a bit too late, but never mind. ;)

vb.org needs a few things:
a) More mods to keep an eye on the little squabbles going on. (E.g. Erwin, he's got a reply in every thread!)
b) More hacks
c) Better hacks

Solutions:
a) Make more people mods
b & c) To get people coding more and more hacks, I reckon it'd be a great idea to make "Hack of the Month" a much bigger thing. First of all, I'd put a little something about HotM on the front page (E.g. "This Month's HotM: some hack"). I'd also make it possible to nominate a hack by clicking on a "Nominate" button at the top of a release. And finally, I'd actually give an incentive for people to want to have the title of "Hacker of the Month".
vBulletin must sell plenty of licences everyday, if they could spare $200 a month, they could offer prizes for being Hacker of the Month.

Just think, if every hacker on the board knew that they'd get something like an mp3 player for being hacker of the month they'd start coding overtime! You'd have more and more hacks being released everyday, and because they'd want to be on the top spot they'd all be doing their best.

Shame it's never going to happen though...

[Dean C]

vbulletin offer money for hacker of month... you've got more chance of chen making a porn forum..

- miSt

[Chris M]

Erm Mist...

Why do you think the Staff here are so "eager" to come back again and again??:p:p;););)

Satan

[Dean C]

Lets not change the subject ;)

Another idea...

Ban the use of php code in the first post in the hacks forums (Full releases and Beta Hacks)

Because an unregistered user can see the hacks code changes if they're in the first post instead of a text or zip file

- mist

[Chris M]

Well...They can see it in any post;)

Make sure that all php & template information are in attachments...

Satan

[Dean C]

duh thats what im on about....

- miSt

[Chris M]

Exactly:)

Satan

[Regs]

Here's a suggestion:

Close this thread or tell certain people that it's not a fricken teen chat line :rolleyes:

~Regstiredofthesamestuffallover.

[Chris M]

Erm...Ok...

I am just agreeing with Mist...

Dont you agree?

Do you think Pirate vB owners should be allowed to get vB hacks?

Satan

[tubedogg]

None of the mods or administrators are paid or compensated to run this site. Jelsoft owns the server it is hosted on but does not run the site.

[Dean C]

true :) ^

So whats the latest tubedogg... are we going to be expecting any more changes around the place?

Regards

- miSt

[Regs]

Originally posted by tubedogg
None of the mods or administrators are paid or compensated to run this site. Jelsoft owns the server it is hosted on but does not run the site. So is that to say that this site is basically the "wild, wild, west" now? Sorry, but I fail to see where or why your comment was posted at this time.

Note that I'm not trying to be antagonistic... it just appears that this thread has degenerated to the point of mindless drivel seen in many other threads around here and noone seems to care?

Cheers,

~Regs.

[Dean C]

I dont agree... Myself and many others have submitted lots of constructive ideas considering that we have been asked to.

Many of them have been unoticed but some of them have and the forums are slowly becoming better (IMO of course)

- miSt

[DrkFusion]

IMO=?

And yes I agree with Mist, mindless drivel? no..
Constructive ideas? Definetly...

We are just trying to contribute 'everything' we have to this community, and if you and others thinks this is bad, I am gladly willing to turn my back on this community at your word, like some others.

[Dean C]

IMO = in my opinion..

- miSt

[tubedogg]

Originally posted by Regs
So is that to say that this site is basically the "wild, wild, west" now? Sorry, but I fail to see where or why your comment was posted at this time.I never said anything of the sort. It was in response to the post that suggested that mods were paid, and the post that Jelsoft should contribute money to the HotM contest.

[Dean C]

So tubedogg what can we expect to happen over the next few months on vbulletin.org?

Regards

- miSt

[TECK]

tubegogg, actually mods are paid, only at vb.com and only if they provide support for members.
so you do get paid. because you provide support (some mods don't because they are to comfy to be active helpers) ;)

[tubedogg]

Yes, Chen and I, and the other support team members, are paid for our time doing support on vB.com. However no one is compensated for working on vB.org - not Chen or myself, and not any of the mods here. It is coincidence that some of the same people are mods at both places.

[Chris M]

That is a shame...

Though some people, like Xenon & Logician, would be (and in some cases are) happy to work as a Moderator without pay here, purely because they enjoy vBulletin.org so much!:)

Satan

[Regs]

I never said anything of the sort. It was in response to the post that suggested that mods were paid, and the post that Jelsoft should contribute money to the HotM contest.Kevin,

Sorry about that insinuation... it wasn't until I went back and read a couple of the previous pages that I clued into what you were replying to.

However, I do stand by what I implied in that there does not appear to be any moderators providing guidance on these forums. By guidance I am refering to asking posters to get back on topic, moving off-topic posts, warning members that continue to stray off-topic, closing threads that have obviously lived out there usefulness, etc...

The ability to do such things is a strength of the vb software. And whether Jelsoft wants to admit to it or not, this place is a huge reflection on their company and their software. I just think it makes sense that a little more attention is paid to what is going on over here. As the thread name states, it is just a suggestion to make vb.org a better place.

Cheers,

~Regs.

[Chris M]

A valid one...

But then again - How off-topic or on-topic a topic actually is is up to the individual's opinion;)

So far, this topic has been mostly on-topic...

To be quite honest, a suggestion of how to make vB.org better would be to ask people like yourself, for instance, to stop making "OFF-TOPIC" cries every time you see a single post that doesnt conform to your view of the thread...

People have different ways of thinking, and different attitudes...

Up until now, I have put up with it in this thread for long enough...Every single post I see from you in this thread slates one or a group of members, and I am getting tired of it...

Therefore a valid suggestion would be to leave the Moderators and Administrators to decide what is what, and keep your personal opinions out of threads that dont concern just you...

Im sorry if I appear rude and blunt, but I do strongly feel that the more criticisms of members and/or their behaviour is part of what hinders this community's growth...

If we could all just drop this now, and get back to proper suggestions, it would be better for all...

=-=

On to a suggestion...

I think that Mods should go through the forums ever now and then, and Merge threads that are similar in nature...

i.e. - For god knows how long now, I have seen the same requests in the "Requests" forum...

Perhaps if a Mod or two merged all the threads of the same kind together, we could reduce the amount of unanswered, then "^bump"ed threads, by the mods simply replying - Search for "********" or whatever...

They could then close that thread, and move it to another forum, named "Archives" or something...

Then, once a month, that "Archives" forum could be purged to make space for new threads...

Satan

[Xenon]

Well it's a good suggestion satan, but you know this will take up a large ammount of time to always find the thread this request has been posted before and merge it ;)

[Chris M]

I see...

Perhaps if we recruited a few vB.org'ers, (like myself for instance), we could help identify which threads need merging, then post it or PM it to you or Chen or something...

Satan

[Dean C]

Why not have someone go throught the requests forum and then take the answered requests and post them into the hacks database..

- miSt

[Chris M]

Because not everybody thinks to search the Hacks Database;)

Satan

[NTLDR]

Originally posted by hellsatan
Because not everybody thinks to search the Hacks Database;)

Not everyone adds them to the database either ;)

[Erwin]

Originally posted by hellsatan

On to a suggestion...

I think that Mods should go through the forums ever now and then, and Merge threads that are similar in nature...

i.e. - For god knows how long now, I have seen the same requests in the "Requests" forum...

Perhaps if a Mod or two merged all the threads of the same kind together, we could reduce the amount of unanswered, then "^bump"ed threads, by the mods simply replying - Search for "********" or whatever...

They could then close that thread, and move it to another forum, named "Archives" or something...

Then, once a month, that "Archives" forum could be purged to make space for new threads...

Satan

Good idea. Members should really take up more responsibility and do a search in the "Request" forum, and then just add a post to the same request to bump it up, rather than clutter that forum with a new thread for something that was requested before.

[Chris M]

Indeed...

Perhaps the "Thread Similarity" code from vB3 could be adapted to vB2, so that we could find similar threads more easily;)

Satan

[DrkFusion]

yes the Thread Similarity code would work magnificently here, I believe Velocd had coded one based on it, not exact codes, his own codes, but same idea.

- Regi Mantel

[Chris M]

Uhuh...

That would be a good addition to help...

Satan

[Xenon]

Originally posted by Mist
Why not have someone go throught the requests forum and then take the answered requests and post them into the hacks database..

- miSt

because of most hacks in request forums are not as long to put it into a file, just php-code tags..

[Chris M]

Indeed...

Perhaps we could get a few bits of code grouped together?

Like -

Minor Modifications hacks - File 1
[file description - this contains *** and *** and ***]

Minor Modifications hacks - File 2
[file description - this contains *** and *** and ***]

etc...

Satan

[pcoskat]

Sorry if this has been mentioned (I only read the first 5 pages of this thread...)

Anyway, I wouldn't mind seeing a directory (or just a simple list) of Hack Installers available for hire.

While many of the visitors to this site know how to install hacks, there are many like me who have NO idea, and don't plan to learn.

I am more than willing to pay for installation...a list of 'expert installers' would be terrif!

Also, a directory of Hacked Boards would be cool, too....with a list of the installed hacks listed next to the name of the site.

Frequently, I'll visit a the website of someone who has posted on vB.or and I'm always amazed at some of the ways they've integrated hacks into their sites - but I tend to 'randomly' find this...

A list or directory would be cool...

Thanks for listening! (again, I'm sorry if these suggestions were already made...)

[Chris M]

@pcoskat -

Unfortunately, I dont think this would work...

Take darkblazes.com (my site) for instance...

I have so many hacks installed (from here and custom/exclusive ones), that it would be hard for me to remember or accurately record all the hacks that are installed on it...

As for installing hacks...

I work for FREE when it comes to installing hacks (unless they are like major hard jobs), as I feel that I owe it to the community...

Due to my school studies, I wouldnt want to commit myself to the list of "expert installers", because I am not available during the week (usually), and sometimes at weekends...

Satan

[NTLDR]

Originally posted by Mist
Why not have someone go throught the requests forum and then take the answered requests and post them into the hacks database..

I think that perhaps requests that have been fufilled should maybe be moved to another forum, so that the requests forum is just left with unanswered or unfinished requests.

[Chris M]

True...

But Merging similar threads could help reduce the amount of threads needing to be moved;)

Satan

[Erwin]

Originally posted by NTLDR
I think that perhaps requests that have been fufilled should maybe be moved to another forum, so that the requests forum is just left with unanswered or unfinished requests.

Good idea too. A lot of those answered requests have mini-hacks in them that are gems. :) Xenon and Logicians are great with these kinds of mini-hacks.

[Dean C]

Originally posted by NTLDR


I think that perhaps requests that have been fufilled should maybe be moved to another forum, so that the requests forum is just left with unanswered or unfinished requests.

Yea thats a good idea too... We should try and install the support forum thing there as it makes life so much easier

And perhaps stick a massive header above the forum with a search box and a message above it saying:

Please search for the hack you would like before requesting it. Thanks

_-__

I think that would work really well :D

- miSt

[Xenon]

Originally posted by NTLDR


I think that perhaps requests that have been fufilled should maybe be moved to another forum, so that the requests forum is just left with unanswered or unfinished requests.

Hmm, sounds like a very good idea to me, i support this idea as mod of requestforum and as user ;)

@Erwin: thanks :)

[Mr_P]

ok dont start flaming but thought while i had a spare bit of time on me hands i would do a quick post.

Lately in posts i have orginal posters who make hacks get flamed for hacks that dont seem to conform to one thing or another.
We should be giving as much support to all hackers as without these,half of us would`nt have the boards we do today.

I can see why hackers dont release hacks as they face an ongoing battle to provide support for it and some obvioulsy dont have the time to give support.But the ones that do,do an excellant job and most if not all go out of their way to help others and its these who should recieve all the credit.

What i suggest is a rate system of all hackers (new and old) in the first post when a hacker posts a hacks a button appears where anyone can press it and that Hacker is awarded that point.

Now on main page of forum home or elsewhere a top 5 of hackers or top 10.This would give hackers something to strife for and show everyone who the top really are.

Even u wanted to go further could be one button to rate top hacker and another for support to hack so we can see who really does out of their way to provide feedback to hacks.

I know its just iceing on the cake but i reckon it would be a neat feature and with the top hackers on here should`nt be hard to implement.

Like i say proberly not feasible but is worth consideration anyway.

[Chris M]

Well...

Although I think it sounds a good idea, it would only encourage people who are new to vB to copy existing hacks and call it their own, or cause people to start spamming the Full Releases forum just to get their hack to be "top"...

In theory it is a good idea, but in practice it isnt - We as vBulletin hackers shouldnt be put into competition with each other...In my experience, it wouldnt be fair on the newer or less knowledgable hackers, or the existing consistent hackers who have developed strong friendships amongst the community...Putting people into competition is never good for the community, as rivalrys and all sorts of bad feeling can seed from it...

Satan

[Mr_P]

yeah i agree with that and tried to compensate for that by saying to options and one would be the feedback to hacks after they had been posted.
Many people go out of their way to give help after a hack so this would ov been added to the table once they had voted.But yep you do raise some good points.

[Chris M]

As do you;)

Perhaps a more immediate focus would be the Requests forum...

Also something I have noticed :

Is it just me, or are more and more requests being made in "General Hacking Discussion"?

I myself have found me asking Requests in there...

Perhaps a clean through of that forum as well might be a good idea;)

Satan

[DrkFusion]

I think an ok suggestion would be to implement a sort of bot that Filburt has at his site, it could maybe only work in the Requests forum or so, and when someone 'requests' a hack, the bot searches the hacks database for it, and returns result, it seems to work at Web Design Forums, and I think the bot could also give the user some hints on how to search while it does it for them, which would encourage the user to use the features available, also may I state that if it is installed, do not tell anyone that it is a bot, don't even mention there is a bot :)

[Erwin]

Originally posted by DrkFusion
I think an ok suggestion would be to implement a sort of bot that Filburt has at his site, it could maybe only work in the Requests forum or so, and when someone 'requests' a hack, the bot searches the hacks database for it, and returns result, it seems to work at Web Design Forums, and I think the bot could also give the user some hints on how to search while it does it for them, which would encourage the user to use the features available, also may I state that if it is installed, do not tell anyone that it is a bot, don't even mention there is a bot :)

Very good idea :).

I doubt that Chen will want to hack this site anymore though... he's probably going to wait for vB3.

[Tony G]

Thats a really good idea, would be useful to the community. :)

[Dean C]

I don't like the idea. You can never rely on AI and also this bot stuff. The day that vbulletin.org becomes run by an imaginary person is the day when my job here will be done

My two cents..

- miSt

[Xenon]

hmm, good idea, which will stop a lot where can i find this bla bla...

Thats the most annoying thing in the request forum and would make my work easier.. :)

[DrkFusion]

Originally posted by Mist
I don't like the idea. You can never rely on AI and also this bot stuff. The day that vbulletin.org becomes run by an imaginary person is the day when my job here will be done

My two cents..

- miSt
First of all, its not an AI, it just responds to certain formation of words. vBulletin.org will not be run by bots, it would only aid people in the Requests forum.

Also what job? :p

[Dean C]

In theory it is AI drk. But still no system is perfect. Like i said i just don't like the idea of an imaginary person helping people out as bot's do get things wrong. Also programming it to answer questions will take quite a long time.

- miSt

[Xenon]

it would just post some helping links, like the similar threads feature of vb3 :)

[Dean C]

I don't like the idea - i'm just prejudiced against it from the start :)

[DrkFusion]

Well it wouldn't be AI (in theory) because, an AI in general should be able to detect, sensor, analyze, reorganize, think and much more. All this does is compare text, and different construction of words. It would release alot of load of the mods, and no one would have to know its there, if I were the admins/mods I wouldn't even tell anyone if they installed it our not, this will lead to mis-use of the feature.

[Erwin]

In that case, just refer people to the "Search" link. ;)

[DrkFusion]

But wouldn't it be easier for a User, that sees no light, has no life, and dedicates 24/7 to vB.org (and I don't mean you (Erwin) or Xenon)

I think a userbot dedicated to just one forum, would release atleast that little load off you, and it would become like a bot that tells people of the new features for instance.

Say I request a Arcade Hack, the bot would look for keywords Arcade, since Hack, and maybe some other words would be unsignificant, and if some results are brought back for Arcade, it can post a link to the search query, and inform the user of the search feature, the capabilities to this is not limited.

[Dean C]

I like helping people out. If some robot beat me to it i'd be pretty miffed. That's why i don't like Xenon ;) hehe

- miSt

[Xenon]

scanning post......

Keyword 'Xenon' appeared....

rescan post....

small attack on Xenon....

reaction: call function Ban Mist....


:D

@Drk: yeah, exactly what i think...
It could really help us :)
Or at least the similar thread feature should be installed :)

[Dean C]

Similar Threads in vb3 is pointless. It's not accurate enough. I mean @ vbulletin.com it shows about 3 useless posts per post in the similar threads... which are hardly remotely related..

Why can't we do everything the traditional way... and help people ourselves ;) ?

- miSt

[DrkFusion]

Stop whining Mist

[Bane]

I would like to see something in the database like a FAQ section. If I had a dollar for everytime someone asked the same damn question about the divbyzero error in vbStats I could retire somewhere...

I would like to comment on some people saying that Hackers should be required to support their hacks, simply by saying.. Your insane. There is an old saying "Don't look a gift horse in the mouth" or something to that effect. We are giving you part of something we worked hard on, for your use, and in most cases free of charge. In this situation I would say if you are unhappy with the support for the hack the obvious answer would be to not install it, you can't lose.

That does however bring me to saying that there could be some sort of pass along system for answering questions in threads. When I was unable to answer questions about the hack people like FWC and Kurafire stepped in and began answering questions like pros. These were people who understood the hack, who were fluent in the errors and problems, and most importantly who were glad to assist and help people with one of the most popular and sloppiest coded vB hacks to date. It would be nice if they could be recognized as such in the database.

Spin offs would be another issue. I was away for quite some time and Kurafire released a hack (http://www.vbulletin.org/hacks/index.php?s=&action=showhack&hackid=880) to my hack. Once this is installed in the final version this becomes a moot point. This thread is just a bit confusing, and there should be someway around this. But my mind is a bit muddled right now so I will leave that to clearer headed folk.

This has been my 2 cents. ^^

[Dean C]

Some good points there. I requested some kind of FAQ system available for hacks too. Perhaps if myself and you and some other well-established members put something like this forward then Chen might consider doing it.

Also it's good to say you back Bane :)!

Regards

- miSt

[nuno]

I would like to see the Full Releases forum like the Hacks db, divided into categories.

[Erwin]

Originally posted by nuno
I would like to see the Full Releases forum like the Hacks db, divided into categories.

Good idea. :) Then again, with all hacks forced to be in the db, it may not be necessary.

[KuraFire]

Originally posted by Mist
Some good points there. I requested some kind of FAQ system available for hacks too. Perhaps if myself and you and some other well-established members put something like this forward then Chen might consider doing it.

Also it's good to say you back Bane :)!

Regards

- miSt

You mean to tell me that nobody has written a database-driven FAQ replacement for the 4-templates-based version of vB yet?

If so, then I'll be writing that one this weekend. :)
Contact me if you want details :p

[KuraFire]

Originally posted by Bane
That does however bring me to saying that there could be some sort of pass along system for answering questions in threads. When I was unable to answer questions about the hack people like FWC and Kurafire stepped in and began answering questions like pros. These were people who understood the hack, who were fluent in the errors and problems, and most importantly who were glad to assist and help people with one of the most popular and sloppiest coded vB hacks to date. It would be nice if they could be recognized as such in the database.

You mean like, a field where you can list a bunch of users who have said that they'd provide support as well, right?

That'd be a nice idea indeed, esp. for such big hacks like vBStats :)

[Corbu]

I really think that vborg should upgrate to vb3 now because the forum is so popular and the reference in vbulletin to stay on vb2.2.9

The, I think you souhld work more togheter with vb.com because a lot of times, I'm searching about templates modifications, and Sometimes I found this at vbulletin.org and sometimes at vbulletin.com and now...sometimes at vbulletintemplates.com

For Hacks It is only vborg, but for templates..... it's very hard...
I think you should decided to stop speaking about templates on vb.com and vb.org ...

____
Sorry for my english...

I hope you understand what I mean...

[Erwin]

vbulletintemplates.com is a 3rd party website, not part of the official vB support forums.

Mind you, so is vB.org, strictly speaking, but at least it has a close affiliation with the offical vB.com support site. :)

As for upgrading to vB 3... not yet, since it's not available... vB.org is meant to be the "hack" support site, so it should run a vB version that has lots of hacks - vB 3 hasn't been released so running it defeats the purpose of having vB 2 hacks here.

[Xenon]

that's the point, there are a lot of hacks in vb.org, so upgrading isn't that easy ;)

dividing the full releases into subcategories is a very good idea i think, because it's hard to go through it :)

[Dean C]

Originally posted by KuraFire


You mean to tell me that nobody has written a database-driven FAQ replacement for the 4-templates-based version of vB yet?

If so, then I'll be writing that one this weekend. :)
Contact me if you want details :p

I'm confused. 4-templates-based-version of VB?

[DrkFusion]

There is already a faq manager. Hack released

[KuraFire]

Originally posted by Mist


I'm confused. 4-templates-based-version of VB?

the FAQ of a standard vBulletin consists of 4 templates and nothing else. These are simply hardcoded HTML FAQ contents.

Would be Muuuuch easier to have them database-driven where you can do all kinds of dynamic stuff with 'm, and more easily add new items to the FAQ etc...

DrkFusion: ah, then I must search for that :D

[Dean C]

Indeed. Freddie or tubedogg released it a while ago. I'm not sure if it works with the latest versions of vb though :)

- miSt

[Bad Bunny]

It looks buggy as all get down form the support topic for it.

[Erwin]

The FAQ Edit works very well... as long as you know how to make it work with the latest vB. :)