Release level

[dismas]

This isn't so much feedback as it is a question about how the site is run.

I was looking through the lists of coders and designers and noticed that they're broken up by "Release Level". What is a release level and what does it mean to be in Release Level 5 vs. Release Level 6 and so on?

[SCRIPT3R]

where is this list?

[Michael Biddle]

hover over the user title, and it shows our release level

[SCRIPT3R]

hover over the user title, and it shows our release level
i know about that, but i was curious about what LIST he was referring to?
I was looking through the lists of coders and designers

[Kirk Y]

He's referring to the Coder (https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showgroups.php?show=coders) & Designer lists (https://vborg.vbsupport.ru/showgroups.php?show=designers).

User Titles
The new points based system has being installed, with associated new titles. A members points take into account various factors involved with modifications (not just installs). A members points are not directly visible - in fact there are only three visible titles - Coder, Designer, and Coder/Designer. You only need one point to be a coder or designer (or 1 point of each for the joint title). Everyone will also have a "Release Level" based on their total points - the more points you have, the higher your release level - an indication of how much you have released (and how popular your work has become). Hovering over the user title will show what level people have reached.

Every coder/designer will also have an individual coder and designer release level, viewable by displaying the coder or designer list.

[SCRIPT3R]

Ahh, i've never seen those before.

[dismas]

Ah, interesting system! Thanks!

[Reeve of shinra]

interesting indeed.

[Shazz]

haha people never reliazed vb.org even had them :)
Theyve been there for a while now

[Dream]

^^ release level 7

I code bester than Paul and Cyb together.

[Shazz]

^^ release level 7

I code bester than Paul and Cyb together.

Paul is Release Level 9
Cyb is Release Level 8

[Dream]

I'll take it you can't take a joke then.

[Shazz]

I'll take it you can't take a joke then.

A joke?
Where? :eek:

[Dream]

Were you flamebaiting me or were you serious?

[G0F0RBR0KE]

I think he was being serious o.o

[Paul M]

Settle down people, keep to the topic. :)

[Shelley_c]

Inconsistencies it seems in the level release system. Princeton seems to have a level 6 release markup against the amount of releases.

How did the release system actually calculate your level release and does it take favourtism into account?

One more question. Level 5, does this allow me to request for a level 1 brand so I don't feel so important paul?

[Paul M]

How did the release system actually calculate your level release
That will not be revealed.

does it take favourtism into account?
Yes, of course it does :rolleyes:

One more question. Level 5, does this allow me to request for a level 1 brand so I don't feel so important paul?
No.

[King Kovifor]

Yes, of course it does :rolleyes:

What doesn't take favoritism into account. That is just the way life is. :rolleyes: lol

[Shelley_c]

That will not be revealed.


Yes, of course it does :rolleyes:


No.

Another question paul. I've looked at princetons release amount (which is 31)
or there abouts, now I've got a release amount of 60+ so how can this warrant such a high level release for princeton and why is is system looking like it's flawed?

If the release levels system is a flaw and crawling with inconsistencies what's to say the board/hack of the month system isn't riddled in flaws. I'm sure there may be reasons why some people have higher release levels for such a small contribution count but if the release level system is flawed and/or being tampered with to benefit the few privileged then why have a release level system in place and shouldn't these issues/inconsistencies be addressed?

[Marco van Herwaarden]

To calculate the release levels a lot more factors are considered then only the number of releases. (and no we will not disclose the full calculation).

I won't reply to the second half of your post as those questions are all "what if's" based on the assumption that our system is flawed. There are currently no flaws that we are aware of.

[EnIgMa1234]

Another question paul. I've looked at princetons release amount (which is 31)
or there abouts, now I've got a release amount of 60+ so how can this warrant such a high level release for princeton and why is is system looking like it's flawed?

If the release levels system is a flaw and crawling with inconsistencies what's to say the board/hack of the month system isn't riddled in flaws. I'm sure there may be reasons why some people have higher release levels for such a small contribution count but if the release level system is flawed and/or being tampered with to benefit the few privileged then why have a release level system in place and shouldn't these issues/inconsistencies be addressed?
A lot more than the release amount is considered. For example you have 700+ installs. That would also play a factor.

[King Kovifor]

Another question paul. I've looked at princetons release amount (which is 31)
or there abouts, now I've got a release amount of 60+ so how can this warrant such a high level release for princeton and why is is system looking like it's flawed?

If the release levels system is a flaw and crawling with inconsistencies what's to say the board/hack of the month system isn't riddled in flaws. I'm sure there may be reasons why some people have higher release levels for such a small contribution count but if the release level system is flawed and/or being tampered with to benefit the few privileged then why have a release level system in place and shouldn't these issues/inconsistencies be addressed?

The favoritism was a joke, but lets look at the facts:

You have 61 releases, yes, but only 700 installs. Princeton has 31 releases, you beat him in that section. But he has over 2200 installs.

It's not just based upon releases.

[Paul M]

The system is working fine, if you want to believe otherwise that's up to you. I have other things to work on. :)

[Attilitus]

And no system is perfect... Even if this system was "crawling with inconsistencies" it wouldn't be that big of a deal... at the end of the day it is just the number that appears next to Release Level when you mouse over the small-texted usertitle of a user on a message board.

I doubt that the fabric of space-time will come undone if the system is not absolutely perfect.

[hambil]

For what it's worth, from someone who has been here a while, what we have now is a subjective system. This is not news. We where told back when the old system was being retired that the new system would be much more subjective. I'm not thrilled with it, but it is better than the objective system we had before, which generated some truly ridiculous results.

[Marco van Herwaarden]

Hmmm i think you are mixing up objective and subjective. ;)

The old system implicated a "value" (ie. Senior coder, Master coder) to the quality of the work of a coder, only based on numbers like number of installs or number of releases. The problem with this was that the number of releases does not say anything about the quality of the work.

With the new system we have been trying to present an objective number that does not implicate anything about the quality of the work.

[hambil]

Hmmm i think you are mixing up objective and subjective. ;)

The old system implicated a "value" (ie. Senior coder, Master coder) to the quality of the work of a coder, only based on numbers like number of installs or number of releases. The problem with this was that the number of releases does not say anything about the quality of the work.

With the new system we have been trying to present an objective number that does not implicate anything about the quality of the work.
No, I think I got it right. Take the simple example of a question:
"Is this text right aligned?" is an objective question, with an objective answer.
"Is this text any good?" is a subjective question, with a subjective answer.

The system you have now uses subjective questions such as 'how good are these releases', 'how supportive is the author', 'how valuable to the community are these releases'. The old system only used objective questions such as 'how many installs does this author have' and 'how many releases do they have'.

[Marco van Herwaarden]

I see this different:

The old system gave a subjective value: Master Coder (is this member a better coder then a Junior coder????)

The current system gives only a number, no value attached to that. A higher release level does not implicate a better coder.

[hambil]

I see this different:

The old system gave a subjective value: Master Coder (is this member a better coder then a Junior coder????)

The current system gives only a number, no value attached to that. A higher release level does not implicate a better coder.
Perhaps you are applying a negative connotation to the word 'subjective' that doesn't exist. Whatever the result (which I've already agreed is improved from the old system) the means you use to achieve that result are subjective. It's a good thing. It's also fact, and you're too smart for me to go quoting a dictionary on you ;)

I think you are, perhaps, referring to the fact that release level is far more language neutral than the previous system. That's a good thing in this case, and a smart move, but not related to the discussion at hand. Are you saying that a higher release level is not better than a lower release level? Because that's certainly not the impression given by staff comments about it, or by the results seen in the release level list, which shows a strong correspondence between older, more experienced, more successful hackers, and higher release levels.

[nexialys]

actually i'm experienced as a coder... - i might say a wizard - and when i release something here, there was no proof of that regarding my releases... most of them have gone to oblivion just because they were not very useful.. but they were very well coded, (at least the official releases.. lol) and that was not enough to give me a level 9.. .lol

[Paul M]

The system you have now uses subjective questions such as 'how good are these releases', 'how supportive is the author', 'how valuable to the community are these releases'.

A small amount of subjectiveness plays a part - in so much as things like user ratings and motm are taken into consideration, but for the most part, releases, installs [and vb version] are the main inputs. They are not subjective.

As for 'how supportive is the author' - By this I can only assume you mean is the supported box ticked - this plays no part in the calculation.

[Guest190829]

The release level is a quantitative measurement. The old system had a degree of subjectivity because the titles themselves describe Coder, Advanced Coder, Master Coder...which is a qualitative brand on the coder.

We are steering away from that.

(IE: A members release level has no indication of his coding quality, just a myriad of quantitative factors in the community.)